|
Post by copperx on May 2, 2024 21:11:41 GMT -6
Made me think I'd have another 4-5 years to decide whether to bother doing anything with audio. But who knows when AI will be able to apply classic production styles to something someone recorded. There's certainly a lot to think about. Current thoughts from the coders are that we essentially have 6 years +/- until life as we know it is completely turned upside down. This is not just music, but society in general. Seems a bit quick, but the last 6 months of song AI has progressed exponentially, no matter what the naysayers may say. Buckle up.
I'm a coder and I use AI everyday. I would say 3 years tops, assuming generative AI stays at about the same level as today. If there's a major breakthrough (I doubt it), then everything could change overnight. However, I also remember when the internet was introduced. I thought it would change the world instantly but it took about 10+ years to be part of the fabric of society.
|
|
|
Post by lowlou on May 3, 2024 3:05:32 GMT -6
Will the audio gear value deflect, demand shrink, and the whole ecosystem collapse in a few years ? Maybe.
If you still want to produce music, you'll need all this artillery still, may it be software of hardware.
I hope Intel, AMD etc won't give up on regular CPUs to favor AI CPUs... Brrr that would be a scary development for the creative community.
|
|
|
Post by viciousbliss on May 3, 2024 9:01:51 GMT -6
For me, Internet changed a lot by 1998. Just being so easy to find people to talk to or meet up with. Order things. Access to information. It wasn't that widespread, but it was commonly used by people that were high school and college aged by 1996. By 2003 the online dating stuff really exploded. All of a sudden I had more messages and even phone numbers than I could handle. It was pretty rare for me to run into someone who wasn't using the Internet for a lot by 2004. The adoption seemed to happen a lot slower with older generations. Slower with people who were maybe more blue collar and never really got into tech. Guys that I knew who couldn't find the c drive in Windows Explorer unless you pointed right at it. Nowadays people who would never have used a desktop use the Net through phones. As a result a lot of antisocial people are abusing its capabilities. These types have turned the online dating market polygamous, become toxic social media influencers, and use GPS to go commit crimes in areas that they would never have ventured to previously. Then there's all the other scams. It can actually be quite dangerous to put yourself out there online.
There's so many new types of computers on the horizon. Quantum, biological, I forget the others. These PCs we're using now are going to be extremely archaic and obsolete in the 2030s, if not earlier. Creativity is going to shift to consumers creating their own stuff. People will still create things to sell on the marketplace, it's just a question of if consumers will still want them as opposed to what their computers are generating. Right now we have a lot of badly written entertainment. ChatGPT can write storylines that are worlds better than the major pro wrestling companies, for example.
Our society is so messed up compared to a year like 2008 that I'm looking forward to these changes. At least it will be better for my health. Ironically, it will be easier for people to go backwards if they wish. There will most likely be all sorts of communities with differing levels of tech. You'll probably be able to have communities based in 1990s environments with maybe better medical care. They'll just stay static in regard to certain tech. Then people can just leave if they want a different experience.
|
|
|
Post by indiehouse on May 3, 2024 15:02:56 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by drbill on May 3, 2024 17:11:52 GMT -6
?? Horribly disturbing or a Godsend to Travis fans? Will we be subjected to Elvis doing Taylor Swift and Madonna songs for the rest of eternity?
|
|
|
Post by M57 on May 3, 2024 17:21:33 GMT -6
Will we be subjected to Elvis doing Taylor Swift and Madonna songs for the rest of eternity? Maybe, but you also get Taylor Swift covering Elvis. ..Return To Sender!
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 3, 2024 18:05:51 GMT -6
If everything in the Cold Fusion video comes to fruition in the estimated time-frame, I am also wondering what that means for gear hoarders like myself - in the near term (5 years, maybe) do we just expect demand for all this (already niche) stuff to tank? I'm having fun in the meantime, so will likely just put my head in the sand, but many of us have sunk a sizable chunk of change into this art/field/profession/hobby - definitely a concern. When I posted that original Udio sample, I figured it would be of interest but it seems to have "struck a chord" a bit more than I would have guessed - makes sense though, now that I'm getting a feel for how AI really is going to impact the world in such a dominant way (at least eventually). Thanks for all the interesting opinions/posts. -Chris I think gear prices are tanking already, especially at the high end. Forget what sellers are asking, what are they actually getting? Are people still willing to pay $4k for that KM84 listed on Reverb? Prices initially dropped after the COVID frenzy subsided but now AI has to be factored in and will only become more significant as it appears in every aspect of our lives whether we like it or not. With cost of living pressures mounting and income for most dropping how many can continue to afford to spend crazy money on gear? And from a client’s perspective how long before even charging $20 an hour for a well equipped studio with esoteric vintage gear the studio owner paid a fortune for is now too much for clients when they can type some text into a box, upload a sample of their own voice, and in a couple of minutes generate something that would have taken them weeks and a bunch of $$ to produce and then upload it to all the streaming services the same day? The playing field hasn’t changed, it’s being concreted over and replaced with a theme park with free rides.
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on May 3, 2024 18:13:06 GMT -6
IMHO some exceptions though... Bluegrass Dan and Paul's U47's IMHO will continue to appreciate. As one of the "Ferrari's" of Vintage Mic models. 275 GTB Ferrari's are above 3 Million US $ now!!. Like Picasso's/Rembrandt's and all those Monkeys throwing paint cans. Chris
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 3, 2024 18:17:35 GMT -6
IMHO some exceptions though... Bluegrass Dan and Paul's U47's IMHO will continue to appreciate. As one of the "Ferrari's" of Vintage Mic models. 275 GTB Ferrari's are above 3 Million US $ now!!. Like Picasso's/Rembrandt's and all those Monkeys throwing paint cans. Chris From what I’m hearing from an avid classic car guy prices are falling in that market as well.
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on May 3, 2024 19:43:39 GMT -6
Hadn't heard about this...but I must admit that when I moved "South" a few years back I was around enough country music to really start liking (some) of it - Randy Travis, in his prime, had an amazingly nice voice. Hearing this "rendering" of it, with something new, knowing full-well that he (as far as I know) couldn't pull it off quite like this is actually a use of AI I find acceptable (assuming he was legit involved in the recording process somehow, etc.). I am sure many would disagree, and I understand that, but when I decided to ignore the material's source, it's really not bad at all.
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on May 3, 2024 19:50:26 GMT -6
I think gear prices are tanking already, especially at the high end. Forget what sellers are asking, what are they actually getting? Are people still willing to pay $4k for that KM84 listed on Reverb? Prices initially dropped after the COVID frenzy subsided but now AI has to be factored in and will only become more significant as it appears in every aspect of our lives whether we like it or not. With cost of living pressures mounting and income for most dropping how many can continue to afford to spend crazy money on gear? And from a client’s perspective how long before even charging $20 an hour for a well equipped studio with esoteric vintage gear the studio owner paid a fortune for is now too much for clients when they can type some text into a box, upload a sample of their own voice, and in a couple of minutes generate something that would have taken them weeks and a bunch of $$ to produce and then upload it to all the streaming services the same day? The playing field hasn’t changed, it’s being concreted over and replaced with a theme park with free rides. Well, I see the same trend...but it didn't stop my excitement today when the brand new Buzz Audio Zodiak EQ showed up on my doorstep :-) I'll probably have to be more cautious about my purchases, but for now I'll just stay positive -Chris
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on May 3, 2024 19:53:54 GMT -6
IMHO some exceptions though... Bluegrass Dan and Paul's U47's IMHO will continue to appreciate. As one of the "Ferrari's" of Vintage Mic models. 275 GTB Ferrari's are above 3 Million US $ now!!. Like Picasso's/Rembrandt's and all those Monkeys throwing paint cans. Chris From what I’m hearing from an avid classic car guy prices are falling in that market as well. Interesting... My Ferrari Fanatic Friend thinks otherwise. Hmm... Does the avid guy ever use... Pro Tools? Chris
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 3, 2024 20:11:23 GMT -6
From what I’m hearing from an avid classic car guy prices are falling in that market as well. Interesting... My Ferrari Fanatic Friend thinks otherwise. Hmm... Does the avid guy ever use... Pro Tools? Chris Unless it’s a 250 GTO which seems to be around 10x the price of a 275 GTB.
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 4, 2024 17:40:33 GMT -6
The moment you discover that Taylor Swift is actually AI generated.
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on May 4, 2024 17:57:06 GMT -6
Blank expression?
|
|
|
Post by Bob Olhsson on May 4, 2024 21:07:04 GMT -6
I've never once heard live music that I thought was a recording. The same has been true of theatre.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on May 4, 2024 22:09:53 GMT -6
Hadn't heard about this...but I must admit that when I moved "South" a few years back I was around enough country music to really start liking (some) of it - Randy Travis, in his prime, had an amazingly nice voice. Hearing this "rendering" of it, with something new, knowing full-well that he (as far as I know) couldn't pull it off quite like this is actually a use of AI I find acceptable (assuming he was legit involved in the recording process somehow, etc.). I am sure many would disagree, and I understand that, but when I decided to ignore the material's source, it's really not bad at all. He’s involved. It’s illegal in TN to use someone’s voice without consent for AI.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on May 4, 2024 22:11:21 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by lowlou on May 5, 2024 13:43:55 GMT -6
|
|
|
Post by cyrano on May 15, 2024 9:41:22 GMT -6
How will they be able to tell if AI was used to make anything?
Art specialists regularly authenticate copies. Nobody cares.
Antique dealers routinely make 4 chairs out of one real antique. Not even against the law, as long as there is a part of that one antique chair in every one of the four "new" chairs.
My 14 year old son already uses AI to make his homework. One of his teachers figured she could use AI to detect that. It took him an hour or so to find a solution to that.
The most successful recent fashion chain (Shein) only sells cheap copies and look-a-likes. And they are expanding into electronics and any other product that's of interest.
Some in the music industry routinely re-release songs with a different title and a few even copyrighted silence.
Our world is composed of fakes. And you can't stop progress.
The real problem isn't on the output side. It's on the input side. What have they used to train the AI? And that fight has already started. It might just make libraries of stuff more valuable.
The EULA of AI sites is pretty much standard stuff. Nobody reads these. If you agree without reading, you're in for a few surprises. Facebook owns copyright to EVERYTHING you post on it. Your words, your music, your pictures. Etc. If you just wake up on that right now, you'd better not use the net at all.
You still own copyright on your mail. Well, maybe not if you're still a HotMail user. But you don't own your own words (and pictures and music) if you're using Whatsapp. Again, etc.
Remember, if the service you use is free, you are the product. In the end, large companies will win from average users. Companies have more resources, and, most important, companies don't die. Maybe a class action lawsuit will have more effect, but nobody has tried that yet. IANAL and laws differ a lot between countries, but I could see that happening.
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 15, 2024 20:30:37 GMT -6
There has been a literal explosion of AI generated YouTube channels lately.
I watch a lot a photography related YouTube videos specifically showcasing renowned photographers from the past.
I reckon about 80% of those videos created in the last year are AI.
They mostly follow the same formula with a slideshow of the photos including music and captions (often misspelled) and sometimes AI generated voiceovers which are typically just scripted directly from Wikipedia often with mispronunciations.
Sometimes the same photo appears more than once in the slideshow most likely due to being cropped differently or the contrast or colour is different enough to fool the AI algorithm into thinking it is a different photo altogether from the other.
It really does wear thin pretty quickly especially when you are prompted at the end to “like”, “subscribe” and support all the hard work of the channels ‘creator’ by sending donations to their Patreon account. 🙄
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 15, 2024 20:46:21 GMT -6
How will they be able to tell if AI was used to make anything? Art specialists regularly authenticate copies. Nobody cares. Antique dealers routinely make 4 chairs out of one real antique. Not even against the law, as long as there is a part of that one antique chair in every one of the four "new" chairs. My 14 year old son already uses AI to make his homework. One of his teachers figured she could use AI to detect that. It took him an hour or so to find a solution to that. The most successful recent fashion chain (Shein) only sells cheap copies and look-a-likes. And they are expanding into electronics and any other product that's of interest. Some in the music industry routinely re-release songs with a different title and a few even copyrighted silence. Our world is composed of fakes. And you can't stop progress. The real problem isn't on the output side. It's on the input side. What have they used to train the AI? And that fight has already started. It might just make libraries of stuff more valuable. The EULA of AI sites is pretty much standard stuff. Nobody reads these. If you agree without reading, you're in for a few surprises. Facebook owns copyright to EVERYTHING you post on it. Your words, your music, your pictures. Etc. If you just wake up on that right now, you'd better not use the net at all. You still own copyright on your mail. Well, maybe not if you're still a HotMail user. But you don't own your own words (and pictures and music) if you're using Whatsapp. Again, etc. Remember, if the service you use is free, you are the product. In the end, large companies will win from average users. Companies have more resources, and, most important, companies don't die. Maybe a class action lawsuit will have more effect, but nobody has tried that yet. IANAL and laws differ a lot between countries, but I could see that happening. Mark Zuckerberg purchased WhatsApp because when FaceBook users realised FB Messenger was being harvested for data many switched over to WhatsApp as it had implemented end-to-end encryption and was touted to respect users privacy. Sometime after Zuckerberg acquired WhatsApp the terms of the service including privacy were changed and now WhatsApp is used as an another source of data collection and sharing by Meta.
|
|
|
Post by viciousbliss on May 15, 2024 21:05:11 GMT -6
Someone made a bunch of obscene AI songs and posted them to Youtube. I listened to some and they sounded like modern music made by humans. Then I watched a bunch of Frontiers Records stuff and some modern metal to see if there was anything new I might want to listen to. All this Frontiers and Metal stuff just sounds like one homogenous blob. Same fake drums, same production choices, same bad loudness war mastering, same vocal tuning and drum time fixes, just one assembly line product after another. It's not that different from AI because so much of it is fake. The other day I saw something about Hatsune Miku at the Auditorium Theatre on their Facebook. They showed this massive line of people lining up to get into the show. I look it up and I guess it's some kinda digitally projected character with a backup band. So, I load up a live video. The music sounds just like this AI stuff. This must be the closest thing to an AI concert that we have. It's not something I would want to watch and I'm just baffled as to why thousands of people are showing up for it. Well, I'm also baffled why thousands of people paid tons of money to see stuff like Motley Crue, Guns N Roses, and Kiss this year. Must have a lot to do with social conformity. Social pressure. Stuff not too different from brainwashing. You get to feel important if you partake. If we go back to stuff like New Kids and Vanilla Ice, you couldn't give them away in 1993 due to social pressure. Now they got most of their fans back and a lot of new ones because they're considering socially acceptable now. 26 years ago you would get a lot of flack from fans of stuff like Manson, Korn, and NIN if you liked King Diamond and Cannibal Corpse. Now every form of hard rock and metal is considered part of the same whole.
This is how we got Gangsta Rap adopted by rich kids in affluent suburbs. MTV and the media and entertainment complexes of the 1990s told everyone this was the hip thing to listen to. And it's the same thing with public health. We could have a new pandemic with a 50% fatality rate and people will be out bragging about how they're throwing caution to the wind because it's seen as the cool thing to do by conservative media. I live zero covid and I'm very aware there's a ton of pressure on me to not put on a 95 mask at indoor events I'm going to with a group. But I could care less about the stigma. Point being that social conformity has already dictated that fake music is acceptable. It would take a real radical change in culture for people to reject all this fake music and go back to wanting something that's all analog and sounds like it came from 1991. At some point we'll see AI-generated stuff that sounds like it's authentically from 1991. It'll be simple at first. Then it'll start generating stuff on par with The Black Album and Use Your Illusion. There was a recent video about AI and jobs from Fanatical Futurist that I need to watch. Should be more than interesting.
|
|
|
Post by bossanova on May 16, 2024 8:03:51 GMT -6
Someone made a bunch of obscene AI songs and posted them to Youtube. I listened to some and they sounded like modern music made by humans. Then I watched a bunch of Frontiers Records stuff and some modern metal to see if there was anything new I might want to listen to. All this Frontiers and Metal stuff just sounds like one homogenous blob. Same fake drums, same production choices, same bad loudness war mastering, same vocal tuning and drum time fixes, just one assembly line product after another. It's not that different from AI because so much of it is fake. The other day I saw something about Hatsune Miku at the Auditorium Theatre on their Facebook. They showed this massive line of people lining up to get into the show. I look it up and I guess it's some kinda digitally projected character with a backup band. So, I load up a live video. The music sounds just like this AI stuff. This must be the closest thing to an AI concert that we have. It's not something I would want to watch and I'm just baffled as to why thousands of people are showing up for it. Well, I'm also baffled why thousands of people paid tons of money to see stuff like Motley Crue, Guns N Roses, and Kiss this year. Must have a lot to do with social conformity. Social pressure. Stuff not too different from brainwashing. You get to feel important if you partake. If we go back to stuff like New Kids and Vanilla Ice, you couldn't give them away in 1993 due to social pressure. Now they got most of their fans back and a lot of new ones because they're considering socially acceptable now. 26 years ago you would get a lot of flack from fans of stuff like Manson, Korn, and NIN if you liked King Diamond and Cannibal Corpse. Now every form of hard rock and metal is considered part of the same whole. This is how we got Gangsta Rap adopted by rich kids in affluent suburbs. MTV and the media and entertainment complexes of the 1990s told everyone this was the hip thing to listen to. And it's the same thing with public health. We could have a new pandemic with a 50% fatality rate and people will be out bragging about how they're throwing caution to the wind because it's seen as the cool thing to do by conservative media. I live zero covid and I'm very aware there's a ton of pressure on me to not put on a 95 mask at indoor events I'm going to with a group. But I could care less about the stigma. Point being that social conformity has already dictated that fake music is acceptable. It would take a real radical change in culture for people to reject all this fake music and go back to wanting something that's all analog and sounds like it came from 1991. At some point we'll see AI-generated stuff that sounds like it's authentically from 1991. It'll be simple at first. Then it'll start generating stuff on par with The Black Album and Use Your Illusion. There was a recent video about AI and jobs from Fanatical Futurist that I need to watch. Should be more than interesting. I remember myself and everyone I knew thinking that Nickelback was the height of corporate garbage rock back in their heyday, and now looking back some of it sounds positively rootsy and raw compared to what's out there today. TL;DR - I gave up my hate for Nickelback a long time ago. I have heard they're genuinely nice guys and that their chops and musicianship are way deeper than their records might always indicate.
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on May 16, 2024 15:43:30 GMT -6
|
|