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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 16, 2024 18:58:37 GMT -6
Is it April 1st? Actually, if this actually incorporated human tendencies, it could be really cool. Like drummers tend to rush fills - I guess anything that’s super locked. There were some examples on the site and I actually thought it did make it feel better. Anyway - not endorsing - just thought it was interesting. mixedinkey.com/human/ |
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Post by tkaitkai on Feb 16, 2024 19:20:46 GMT -6
This is fucking awesome. I have needed something like this for AGES.
The examples on their website are killer, too. Sounds fantastic at 50%.
Demoing immediately.
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Post by bluesholyman on Feb 16, 2024 19:44:41 GMT -6
Thats pretty cool.
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 16, 2024 20:26:18 GMT -6
So how do you use it? Like last insert and then they group together?
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Post by M57 on Feb 17, 2024 5:53:48 GMT -6
I don't get it. What is it doing? ..shifting time? ..altering the waveform? ..in what ways?
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Post by EmRR on Feb 17, 2024 8:16:00 GMT -6
Oh boy.
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Post by bossanova on Feb 17, 2024 8:35:02 GMT -6
This sort of looks like the Humanizer plug. Analog Obsession has a free take on it called the Realizer. Although I don't think the latter works on timing.
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Post by deaconblues on Feb 17, 2024 8:51:37 GMT -6
Very interesting! I’ve used a Max 4 Live extension developed by James Holden for years and years called Group Humanizer. All of my drummer friends started to really dig my live sets. Here’s a great write-up by James where he gets into some of the research and underlying science: www.ableton.com/en/blog/james-holden-human-timing/ |
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Post by chessparov on Feb 17, 2024 8:54:57 GMT -6
Created with a fiendish almost human intelligence. (At 50%)
Chris
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Post by robo on Feb 17, 2024 11:16:35 GMT -6
Does it add swing to quantized tracks? If so, that’s cool, but can be easily done with a time-adjustment plugin.
If this adds “random” beat variations…I dunno. Why not just get off the grid and play music, like a human?
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Post by noob on Feb 17, 2024 11:29:50 GMT -6
If this adds “random” beat variations…I dunno. Why not just get off the grid and play music, like a human? Because convenience pretty much, but looks like an interesting plugin, it just doesn't look like it has much depth to it. I'm not a fan of one knobs usually, too much secrecy involved, but I would like to see more plugins of this nature, maybe it will help with the stale robotic sounding stuff. Of course, it's trying to emulate human imperfection, but that's not an easy thing to do. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 17, 2024 11:34:58 GMT -6
Does it add swing to quantized tracks? If so, that’s cool, but can be easily done with a time-adjustment plugin. If this adds “random” beat variations…I dunno. Why not just get off the grid and play music, like a human? I hear you, but here’s the scenario I’d like to try it on. Let’s say my drum tracks are superior drums…I play it, but I’m not a drummer, so I don’t know nuances like “oh in a 4/4 mid tempo, sometimes I’ll lay back on the 2 cause it feels nice…” I don’t know if that’s a thing, but I don’t know those things…If this thing was THAT deep, it would be awesome…but I doubt it. Worth a demo though. If you had like percussion or hand claps it might be quicker than manually moving them around…of course you could just play it lol. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 17, 2024 11:36:06 GMT -6
If this adds “random” beat variations…I dunno. Why not just get off the grid and play music, like a human? Because convenience pretty much, but looks like an interesting plugin, it just doesn't look like it has much depth to it. I'm not a fan of one knobs usually, too much secrecy involved, but I would like to see more plugins of this nature, maybe it will help with the stale robotic sounding stuff. Of course, it's trying to emulate human imperfection, but that's not an easy thing to do. Which is an interesting question…would you rather hear poor musicianship or locked to the grid perfection? |
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Post by bluesholyman on Feb 17, 2024 11:44:22 GMT -6
Because convenience pretty much, but looks like an interesting plugin, it just doesn't look like it has much depth to it. I'm not a fan of one knobs usually, too much secrecy involved, but I would like to see more plugins of this nature, maybe it will help with the stale robotic sounding stuff. Of course, it's trying to emulate human imperfection, but that's not an easy thing to do. Which is an interesting question…would you rather hear poor musicianship or locked to the grid perfection? I guess it depends on the music? I mean, something like Kansas, Dream Theatre, etc, "progressive rock" generally speaking, its very tight. Humanizing that would be interesting, but I am not sure it would be "good?" I heard subtle differences in the demo, but nothing mind blowing. Maybe its altering the feel, making it less stiff, that sort of thing but without the A/B, I am not sure you'd hear a difference, but you might feel a difference, if that makes sense. |
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Post by lowlou on Feb 17, 2024 11:51:20 GMT -6
Still unclear what it does... Midi, ok, it moves the midi events, but on audio... Something like a tape speed fluctuation ? Humanizing functions, negative & positive track time offset, all this already exists in Reaper and probably in all the other major DAWs. The human plugin probably offers something more. I wish they'd disclose what ! (( Great to see James Holden mentioned on RGO  , I dig his music and technics )) |
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Post by bgrotto on Feb 17, 2024 12:01:10 GMT -6
From their marketing blurb - “swing merely offsets notes to add a touch of syncopation”
Um. No…this is not what swing does. They either don’t know what swing is, or don’t know what syncopation is. In either case, it makes me doubt their notion of musical humanization is, well, musical. Or human.
I don’t normally like to be “forum pedant guy” but in this case, it seems like a probable reflection on the quality of the product.
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Post by tkaitkai on Feb 17, 2024 13:29:55 GMT -6
Damn, just realized there's no demo. That's annoying. It's only $50 and there's a money back guarantee, but still. If I decide to spring for it, I'll definitely report back with my thoughts.
For those questioning the purpose of this plugin, it seems particularly useful to me because I program drums by hand ALL the time, and I'm constantly trying to find better ways to humanize.
So far, the best approach I've found is to start off by taking patterns that are 100% locked to the grid and then use various humanization strategies to taste. Usually, I can get away with more drastic humanization on cymbals/hats/shakers, etc, whereas kicks & snares tend to be much closer to the grid. Sometimes I will select all of the snare hits in a song and manually slide them around by a few milliseconds until it "feels" right. I occasionally do the same with kicks, but paying more attention to how it grooves with the bass.
I also rely heavily on blending in real loops, whether using them as the basis of the entire drum sound, or just using top loops for hats/tambs/shakers. Sometimes MIDI packs come in handy, and I do admit they tend to feel more organic.
As you can probably tell, this gets tedious fast.
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Post by chessparov on Feb 17, 2024 14:49:18 GMT -6
Because convenience pretty much, but looks like an interesting plugin, it just doesn't look like it has much depth to it. I'm not a fan of one knobs usually, too much secrecy involved, but I would like to see more plugins of this nature, maybe it will help with the stale robotic sounding stuff. Of course, it's trying to emulate human imperfection, but that's not an easy thing to do. Which is an interesting question…would you rather hear poor musicianship or locked to the grid perfection? You mean "MidiVanilli" is a choice? |
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Post by niklas1073 on Feb 18, 2024 3:39:41 GMT -6
This is actually super freakin’ interesting in a larger context. I mean it’s nothing new that sample people has always struggled with this and the work to bring a human factor in the game has been done by hand with more or less success. But if these sort of plugs will begin popping up it kinda correlates with the general trend and statistics. This rick beato video touches the topic. There are plenty of signs especially within a new upcoming generation of musicians and consumers that they crave for more substance and human presence in the music. We don’t have to go back more than a decade or two when kids would feel discomfort (i vaguely remember reading or hearing about an article back in the days discussing this) if they heard a song from the 70’s because it wasn’t quantized and pitch corrected, as they had been brought up within a quantized musical environment. But it looks like it was after all, kind of a short era and commerce will likely be picking up on this new wave. These small things like a plugs are probably just first signs, hard to say how big of a return of actual hiring musicians to achieve the real deal will follow from that. But surely the appreciation for those who walk the extra mile might stand.
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Post by jampa on Feb 18, 2024 3:58:08 GMT -6
Very interesting! I’ve used a Max 4 Live extension developed by James Holden for years and years called Group Humanizer. All of my drummer friends started to really dig my live sets. Here’s a great write-up by James where he gets into some of the research and underlying science: www.ableton.com/en/blog/james-holden-human-timing/That was awesome thanks for that |
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Post by Shadowk on Feb 18, 2024 5:30:18 GMT -6
This is actually super freakin’ interesting in a larger context. I mean it’s nothing new that sample people has always struggled with this and the work to bring a human factor in the game has been done by hand with more or less success. But if these sort of plugs will begin popping up it kinda correlates with the general trend and statistics. This rick beato video touches the topic. Yeah, thanks for that vid. 
Oh my word, I've been doing rock & metal for like ever (1998 onwards). It stopped being popular in the late 2000's to 2020's when the Nirvana / Nu-metal phase fell off a cliff and as sooon as I decide to move into Dance / EDM all of a sudden it gets a massive increase and is far more popular than the genre I'm looking at. Oh FFS.. Where's the slap my own face emoji?!
If or should I say when I pick this back up I'm just going to do whatever..
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Post by chessparov on Feb 18, 2024 8:36:45 GMT -6
If this works on humans who drum. AND work at the DMV... I'm buyin'! They would however, know how to register ownership. And work in Windows. Chris |
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 18, 2024 10:41:04 GMT -6
This is actually super freakin’ interesting in a larger context. I mean it’s nothing new that sample people has always struggled with this and the work to bring a human factor in the game has been done by hand with more or less success. But if these sort of plugs will begin popping up it kinda correlates with the general trend and statistics. This rick beato video touches the topic. There are plenty of signs especially within a new upcoming generation of musicians and consumers that they crave for more substance and human presence in the music. We don’t have to go back more than a decade or two when kids would feel discomfort (i vaguely remember reading or hearing about an article back in the days discussing this) if they heard a song from the 70’s because it wasn’t quantized and pitch corrected, as they had been brought up within a quantized musical environment. But it looks like it was after all, kind of a short era and commerce will likely be picking up on this new wave. These small things like a plugs are probably just first signs, hard to say how big of a return of actual hiring musicians to achieve the real deal will follow from that. But surely the appreciation for those who walk the extra mile might stand. It’s a fine line, though. While I respect (some) the songs of say - Alabama - man, the execution left…ahem…a lot to be desired. Those harmonies needed tuners. Of course, it’s all too perfect now, but thank God we have tuner considering who all is making music these days. |
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Post by niklas1073 on Feb 18, 2024 10:52:43 GMT -6
This is actually super freakin’ interesting in a larger context. I mean it’s nothing new that sample people has always struggled with this and the work to bring a human factor in the game has been done by hand with more or less success. But if these sort of plugs will begin popping up it kinda correlates with the general trend and statistics. This rick beato video touches the topic. There are plenty of signs especially within a new upcoming generation of musicians and consumers that they crave for more substance and human presence in the music. We don’t have to go back more than a decade or two when kids would feel discomfort (i vaguely remember reading or hearing about an article back in the days discussing this) if they heard a song from the 70’s because it wasn’t quantized and pitch corrected, as they had been brought up within a quantized musical environment. But it looks like it was after all, kind of a short era and commerce will likely be picking up on this new wave. These small things like a plugs are probably just first signs, hard to say how big of a return of actual hiring musicians to achieve the real deal will follow from that. But surely the appreciation for those who walk the extra mile might stand. It’s a fine line, though. While I respect (some) the songs of say - Alabama - man, the execution left…ahem…a lot to be desired. Those harmonies needed tuners. Of course, it’s all too perfect now, but thank God we have tuner considering who all is making music these days. My point was absolutely not against tuners or beat editing. They are tools that should be used when needed. But when the norm in many genres became every beat is on grid and every note is on absolute pitch, we are talking about aesthetics way beyond fixing up something to be in the ballpark. |
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Post by bgrotto on Feb 18, 2024 11:20:04 GMT -6
Distractingly bad is as distracting as distractingly perfect. But 'regular' bad can be great, as can 'regular' perfect. Depends on the music, the vision of the producer, and the skill of the editor, I suppose.
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, I dig his music and technics ))
