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Post by theshea on Mar 13, 2022 4:24:42 GMT -6
i'd like to improve my studio sound monitoring. it's a one-room-mixing-recording room: 4,2 (large) x 4,6 (deep) x 2,4 m (high). there's a lot of DIY absorbers (all min. 25 cm deep) and DIY basstraps in all 4 cornners (35-40 cm deep). above the mixing position i've got 15 cm absorption on the ceiling. the back of the room is where I record, so that's why I have some rugs, a diffusor and some foam on the ceiling (mainly to tame drum cymbals). my recordings are very dry as the room has not a great sound, i add reverb while mixing. I'd like to improve the monitoring situation. my mixes translate rather good and turn out balanced, volume and EQ wise, although most often I've got a bit to much bass guitar. but it's more the merit of my avantone mixcubes: those get me in the right ballpark. the focal alpha 65's let me hear instruments soloed very well. but when the whole mix is on fire – like on a rock refrain - i can't hear the parts very clear. it's too much at the same time. especially the lows and low-mids are hard to identify. so here are the REW measurements: the right speaker is doing rather good (there's a big hole at 60Hz ...) but the left one is more bumpy. could this be because the left speaker is firing in the direction of the door? or could it be the space underneath the speakers? you can see it in the pics, there's plain laminate ground and plain concrete wall. also, at 50-60Hz the decay is long ... would it help to tame the lows on the focals? would it help to upgrade to eg focal shape 50's? they have tighter bass. i sit at 1,25 m from the speakers. |
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kcatthedog
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 13, 2022 7:58:14 GMT -6
A good start but you do have some differences in those graphs , a over 15 db range in the first left should be addressed, there are differences between it and the waterfall which is a little mystery in terms of room modes etc. and your plus 5K seems to be rising a fair bit too but rt30-60 ms responses are low
I think that suggests you have enough absorption so decay time is acceptable, except very low freq, but the actual freq response could be more linear.
apparent lr discrepancies is just redo the left right measure then exchange the two speakers physically , mark their spots with tape at two corners to make sure they are in same position and redo the measure, if the l l and r r plots are different then you have a problem with the two speakers .
One thing you could do about door is to replicate the absorption on the other wall over the door or make two identical tall gobos on wheels you could roll around .
If you haven't brought speakers forward into the room in say 6 inch increments and remeasured, I do the 3-4 times just to see what happens with your free response, once yo find the best spot, you could also try a subwoofer , same test idea and again just see if yo can get the lower bass more dialed.
On paper the Shape monitors with their passive resisters, should have tighter more controlled bass and people do debate whether ports contribute to freq response irregularities and have longer delay times. I can say that a few year's ago I demoed a variety of small monitors and found the Shape had tighter bass than ported monitors. I also found that the Shape 6.5 with their better response and very useful dsp, gave my amphions and dynaudio lyd 48 a real run for their money, in terms of price performance.
Check too, that the two stands are as secure as possible. I have never used those stands but I have always wondered how secure they really are, depending on the weight of the monitors.
Be interesting to see your clarity and spectrograph plots as well, clarity would reveal those LR discrepancies too.
Its worth some more experimentation and testing a the worse thing that happens is yo get to know your room sonically even better.
Have fun with it too !
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Post by theshea on Mar 14, 2022 11:33:46 GMT -6
thanks for advices. swapping speakers helped make the freq response a bitore linear. but especially the low freq decay got way better. could‘ve also been a measurement error.
moving the speakers forward made everything worse. i can recall doing all sort of speaker positions when getting them new and right close up to the front absorbers was and still is the best position.
its far from perfect but which room is perfect? there‘s a limit to them all. unless big money, pro‘s and a new purpose build room is the plan.
i wish i could improve it even more ... there‘s still this divergence between the left and the right speaker. the left beeing the worser one. only reason i can come up with could be the radiator on the back and side of the left speaker resonating ...
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Post by Bat Lanyard on Mar 15, 2022 19:30:11 GMT -6
Have you tried moving the monitors out towards the walls and angling them to fire behind your head? Without hearing in your room, of course, just looks like they're very close together and angled in a bit more than I'd prefer. My room's a bit smaller, closer to OP's size, but purpose built (by me) within a larger room, so I've hesitated to chime in.
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Post by theshea on Mar 16, 2022 0:22:42 GMT -6
Have you tried moving the monitors out towards the walls and angling them to fire behind your head? Without hearing in your room, of course, just looks like they're very close together and angled in a bit more than I'd prefer. My room's a bit smaller, closer to OP's size, but purpose built (by me) within a larger room, so I've hesitated to chime in. monitors are 130 cm apart and my ears are ca. 120 cm away in my mixing position. moving outwards does worsen the dips in the bass. i will post new measurements later. rhey are a bit better with speakers swapped. |
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Post by theshea on Mar 16, 2022 1:19:56 GMT -6
Be interesting to see your clarity plots as well, clarity would reveal those LR discrepancies too. as stated before, the frequency is a little bit more linear with the speakers swapped, thanks for that tipp. it helped the low decay, too. as one can see in the new RT60 plots attached. i also attach the clarity plot, but i don't know how to read that one ... i think i will just order some focal shape 65 and hear for myself in my room if it helps getting the bass a bit tighter. i know room first, monitor second. but for now i think that's all i can do for room treatment. anyhow, any feedback welcome! |
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kcatthedog
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Post by kcatthedog on Mar 16, 2022 5:36:03 GMT -6
with clarity you want the line rising left to right which you have and you can do separately for both speakers , that would show the discrepancy you are aware of.
It’s supposed to show the mix of direct to indirect sound, you can overlay l and r plots which show which is better( higher), or worse( lower).
You could then recheck from the speakers what’s different con each side of room using the better side as your guide and try to make them as similar as possible.
The Spectograph with its red spots would show you specific freq where your decay time is still high so you might want to check that too.
Once you dial in the Shape( good move), if you still have low dip, you could experiment with a sub to rectify that .
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Post by theshea on Mar 16, 2022 7:06:24 GMT -6
thanks kcatthedog!!!
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