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Post by bchurch on Sept 14, 2022 9:46:07 GMT -6
I've been working on a passion project for almost a year. It's a ten track LP, very much in the school of an actual album, a cohesive artistic statement from individual songs (as opposed to a compendium of singles). Working on my own material I'm happy to write, perform, record, edit, and mix everything from live drums to guitars to bass and so on.
But I have an achilles heel: vocals. I can't sing or scream. I'm just terrible at it (plus I work on this out of my home, where bellowing my frustrations with the world at the top of my lungs doesn't work so well in a multi-unit NYC building). No amount of studio whizbangery will change bad into good - and even if it could, bottling at the source is far preferable.
Not having a super-deep network here locally (and still encumbered by the inability to record at home) I figured I'd try out a few different places online to gauge interest. I wrote a detailed synopsis of what I was looking for, a link to a few instrumentals, some references, etc. Interest? Yes, I got plenty of interest. Lots of people who wanted to audition - but when it came time to actually demo just ghosted. And there were tons of email/message chains, lots of 'getting to know you'-type stuff which, multiplied by six prospects, was time consuming. I offered up the rough lyrics I'd already written but also left the door open to take the song title and run with it.
Now, I will agree that since it's a personal project, having people audition is like watching some 15-year-old dude come to pick up my daughter for a date. This isn't a commodity, I'm attached to it. There isn't a single note, squeal, slide, flam, swell, skronk, or chugga-chugga that I haven't pored over for hours. And writing vocals to a finished song can be tricky, I get that.
All that said, I have received some of the most ghastly, awful, unlistenable dreck imaginable. Lyrically, vocally, performance-wise, sound-wise, other-wise. I know that "good" in music can be relative and that "wrong" can sometimes be "just right". But holy crap-ola, I had some moments where I had to close my laptop lest I return a message with, "why the sam f&*k would you even send me this?" This included one person who I could sense was a tad sensitive and probably fifteen years too young to work with - I sent the nicest, kid-gloved response saying "hey, I really appreciate you putting the time in, there's some good stuff here but it's not what I'm looking for." This resulted in a string of messages that read like the fingerpaintings of the insane - going from dismay to anger to depression and round and round again.
TL;DR - Metal vocalist wanted. Maybe I should just do instrumentals for myself and never release them.
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Post by upstairs on Sept 14, 2022 10:46:18 GMT -6
TL;DR - Metal vocalist wanted. Oooh, OK.   |
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Post by M57 on Sept 14, 2022 10:59:18 GMT -6
I'll be curious to hear responses to this, and especially from the engineer types here. I'll bet most of them have spent more than a few uncomfortable hours as third party witnesses to these types of relationships.
I can reasonably carry a tune, and I pretty much have a hard time imagining anyone but myself singing my songs, so I feel pretty lucky in that sense, but it also gives me some insight as to why you are experiencing your vocalist problem. Bottom line: I don't envy your predicament! ..and sorry, I'm not a metal vocalist.
As a DIY home studio type, mine use to be finding musicians to contribute tracks here and there. And though I can tell you it's a lot easier to find and collaborate on-line with musicians these days, it's still incredibly hard to find good vocalists who know how to serve the song. You many not want to hear this, but I can also tell you that with rare exceptions, and even with instrumentalist, you get what you pay for.
Have you reached out to pros?
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Post by ciscokid on Sept 14, 2022 11:15:09 GMT -6
Collaboration can be tough especially if you have a strong vision for the end result. My only advice is to specifically look for singers that suit your material and give detailed instructions on what you require.
Shooting in the dark hoping to get results that meet your expectations is rarely going to work and will be extremely frustrating.
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Post by Tbone81 on Sept 14, 2022 13:23:35 GMT -6
Your post is the exact reason why I was in an (instrumental) post rock band for years. Everyone kept coming up to us asking if when we were going to get a singer, and we’d roll our eyes and say “never” lol.
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Post by bchurch on Sept 14, 2022 14:31:05 GMT -6
Your post is the exact reason why I was in an (instrumental) post rock band for years. Everyone kept coming up to us asking if when we were going to get a singer, and we’d roll our eyes and say “never” lol. For all the advancements in virtual instruments, machine learning, and AI, it'd be great if I could just type the lyrics and all the influences into a plug-in and be done. Of course, I'm picturing something closer to how Gary and Wyatt created their girlfriend in "Weird Science". |
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Post by keymod on Sept 16, 2022 15:40:09 GMT -6
Male or female vocalist?
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Post by bchurch on Sept 16, 2022 16:26:45 GMT -6
I was actually working with a female a couple years back and I loved what she brought to it. Kind of made it into the Runaways by way of System of a Down or something. But, alas, because she and I went back twenty years (platonically), the Mrs. was very very not cool with it. Unhappy wife, unhappy life, so I had to make the call. But I could entertain hearing anyone who could bring something interesting to the table. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2022 8:11:48 GMT -6
Well, LOL.. I was a metal singer for years, my issue is I have a very umm "sweet" sounding clean voice and if the music is very heavy it just doesn't fit (or gets lost in translation). If we're doing pop metal or nu metal then sure, ironically I'm actually pretty good at the melodic death metal thing (or Bon Jovi metal as they call it). Light passages super clean followed by really low growls for the heavy bits.. If you're looking for a melodic screamer as such keep looking  . I'm easy going, can take criticism well and it's your songs. Want something changed? Fine with me.. However I am busy a lot (like most of the time) so I wouldn't expect this to be a quick process at all. |
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Post by bchurch on Sept 17, 2022 15:01:32 GMT -6
I'll DM you. Be nice about my crummy demo-phase songs, though? Us metal types are very tender folk underneath that mean, crusty exoskeleton.
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Post by johneppstein on Sept 18, 2022 8:46:30 GMT -6
I was actually working with a female a couple years back and I loved what she brought to it. Kind of made it into the Runaways by way of System of a Down or something. But, alas, because she and I went back twenty years (platonically), the Mrs. was very very not cool with it. Unhappy wife, unhappy life, so I had to make the call. But I could entertain hearing anyone who could bring something interesting to the table. Why I never got married! |
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Post by bchurch on Sept 18, 2022 12:09:00 GMT -6
True that. I thought DIY-ing my own gear would make getting new shit into my home studio would make it easier. Turns out, even though Boss-lady really doesn't care much about what it is I do, what I do it with, you know, the things I'm passionate about, she can spot even a new 500 module from 20 yards.
</vent>
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Post by Blackdawg on Sept 18, 2022 13:55:16 GMT -6
So what I got from this is...well.
Welcome to producing!
Communicating your wants/needs to artists is hard. Takes practice and is just as dependent on you as it is on the artist. Natually a better musician will be easier to work with as it won't be their first rodeo. Either way, it can take a while to learn the artist and how to tell them "well that sucked, do it again but do it like ______ instead" in whatever what is needed for them to not be offended, to know how to steer them as an artist to where you need them to be. Their artisit lens is different than yours so you have to learn theirs so you can warp what you are saying to them to get them into the area of your artistic lens.
Either way. Don't be discouraged. Keep trying, be ready to maybe pay some bigger bucks for the right person. And more importantly, avoid the email think unless you know them very well already. Call them. have tome come to your studio if possible. Zoom. Use Sonobus and have them track live into your session from their house. There are SO many ways now to work with folks remotely in a live setting that don't need texts or emails that it's basically inexcusable to not work that way. You will connect with them much much faster this way and "tone" won't be misinterpreted either as often does in emails.
Anyways, I'm not a singer. But hope you find the right person to bring your vision to light!
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Sept 20, 2022 20:17:46 GMT -6
I was actually working with a female a couple years back and I loved what she brought to it. Kind of made it into the Runaways by way of System of a Down or something. But, alas, because she and I went back twenty years (platonically), the Mrs. was very very not cool with it. Unhappy wife, unhappy life, so I had to make the call. But I could entertain hearing anyone who could bring something interesting to the table. Why I never got married! John some how that deserves a “ that’s what she said “😀 |
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Post by jeremygillespie on Sept 20, 2022 21:05:48 GMT -6
True that. I thought DIY-ing my own gear would make getting new shit into my home studio would make it easier. Turns out, even though Boss-lady really doesn't care much about what it is I do, what I do it with, you know, the things I'm passionate about, she can spot even a new 500 module from 20 yards. </vent> I’m feeling lucky. I sheepishly told my wife a few days ago that I purchased a new guitar and her response was …”you don’t want to know what I spent on shoes this month”. Fair enough! |
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Post by gwlee7 on Sept 21, 2022 16:26:43 GMT -6
5 years ago this Friday, my wife bought me a brand new HD 28 as a combined birthday and “thanks for relocating for my career” present. I am also very lucky.
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Post by drbill on Sept 21, 2022 18:54:39 GMT -6
5 years ago this Friday, my wife bought me a brand new HD 28 as a combined birthday and “thanks for relocating for my career” present. I am also very lucky. You relocated to TX for a a D28?!?!?!?!?!?? I'm hoping she makes a ton of money. Sounds like a good woman. LOL. Ok then.... No offense to any of you fine TX folks!!! |
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Post by gwlee7 on Sept 21, 2022 20:27:25 GMT -6
5 years ago this Friday, my wife bought me a brand new HD 28 as a combined birthday and “thanks for relocating for my career” present. I am also very lucky. You relocated to TX for a a D28?!?!?!?!?!?? I'm hoping she makes a ton of money. Sounds like a good woman. LOL. Ok then.... No offense to any of you fine TX folks!!! I am a trophy husband and need to go with her to continue my opulent lifestyle. |
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