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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 20, 2023 18:02:28 GMT -6
Had a beer with Quint last week and I'm convinced that I should at least be taking a DI signal for guitars even if I don't use it. Somehow I've just never gone down the re-amp path. So let's just throw it out there. What's everyone's process here? What tools do you use for re-amping and how do you use them?
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Post by knucklehead89 on Aug 20, 2023 18:55:21 GMT -6
I have a buffered splitter box that use for tracking guitar and bass. I am able to capture a clean DI before pedals and amps via a normal DI setup, then with the splitter I also capture the output of the pedals before the amps, then of course I record the amps in hopes that’s the final sound. But I like like to get both the fully clean DI and one with the pedals as well for options later if needed. Then of course if or when I re-amp I use the Radial reamp box and send it back out to pedals and or amps as needed.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 20, 2023 19:11:18 GMT -6
I have a buffered splitter box that use for tracking guitar and bass. I am able to capture a clean DI before pedals and amps via a normal DI setup, then with the splitter I also capture the output of the pedals before the amps, then of course I record the amps in hopes that’s the final sound. But I like like to get both the fully clean DI and one with the pedals as well for options later if needed. Then of course if or when I re-amp I use the Radial reamp box and send it back out to pedals and or amps as needed. So the buffered DI is just for the post pedal sound... for the pre-pedal sound you're using a standard passive DI and splitting the signal there?
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Post by drumsound on Aug 20, 2023 19:43:43 GMT -6
I've done console aux to a DI in reverse. Every time I take a DI on a guitar, I kind of forget it's there. I should be more active with that. When Greg traded me for his UAD account, there are a bunch of amps in there I should use more.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 20, 2023 19:59:29 GMT -6
I've done console aux to a DI in reverse. Every time I take a DI on a guitar, I kind of forget it's there. I should be more active with that. When Greg traded me for his UAD account, there are a bunch of amps in there I should use more. Same. But in my current live room I could see possibly using a DI signal. Also, I don't keep my best amps in my practice room because I either use them on stage (too lazy to load in and out of practice room) or because they're too old to drag around everywhere. Kind of a shame to not at least have the option to re-amp through those.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2023 20:47:34 GMT -6
Multichannel pre or interface with a good di or a di box and splitter. Then I just use plugs on the di and maybe process it before it hits the plugs and the ir. I prefer using plugs to reamp because it's faster to swap out amp simps and the irs to find ones that fit the performance because the amp and cab are almost parts of the instrument. This extends to the distortion pedals and fx boxes for certain genres like metal, shoegaze, and noise. You'll need to use fx sends and dynamics processing for sure with plugs rather than a real amp and cab in the room that it was recorded in. This is why DIs usually sound bad in a mix unless processed to hell but of course The Beatles and Led Zeppelin got away with them.
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Post by Quint on Aug 20, 2023 22:41:59 GMT -6
Little Labs Redeye DIs are perfect for getting DI takes of guitar signals. They work in active or passive mode, so you can use them with guitars with active or passive pickups. They also have reamp capabilities too.
You can use Redeye DIs to grab DI splits at multiple points (naked guitar, post dirt pedals but pre time-based-fx pedals, post entire pedal board, etc.). Redeye DIs are a no brainer for guitars.
I use RNDIs for bass and organ. They capture the low end well. I use three RNDIs for capture of my Hammond and another RNDI for direct capture of the bass. The rest of the bass DIs are directly out of the bass amp head itself.
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Post by theshea on Aug 21, 2023 4:58:01 GMT -6
i only ever record a DI with bass guitar. with electric guitars i never DI, always mic on amp and never more than 2. more than enough with good instrument and amp. the bass DI i reamp with a palmer daccapo reamping pedal.
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Post by svart on Aug 21, 2023 8:15:46 GMT -6
I have a redeye as well as a pile of countryman 85's. If I need to take DI of a guitar I usually do a "before effects" DI (just the guitar), then also an "after effects" DI (guitar plus effects). I've had too many situations where the artists dial up way too much of the effect(s) or set the amp wrong or something or we simply changed direction or the mix needed something different.
This way I can always go back and adjust things without having to redo them.
Also got real tired of the "just tell the artist to redo it" advice and the backlash it creates.
It's really hard to tell an artist that they need to redo a ton of the song when everyone agreed it was fine during tracking. It makes you look like a moron when you have to tell them that you *thought* it was fine, but it turns out it wasn't for whatever reason.
Not everyone is sympathetic to your job when it's their money being spent on what they believe to be your mistake. This completely negates all of that.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2023 8:50:06 GMT -6
Pretty much what Svart said but I use the Suhr Reactive (which is good BTW), now I'm only doing it for myself I don't always bother though.
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Post by ragan on Aug 21, 2023 9:02:34 GMT -6
I use a Countryman 85 for a DI signal. Then I use the Radial re-amp box to re-amp. Simple. I get takes with the Iridium or Suhr RL and then re-amp a bunch of stuff when I have a day when I can be loud. I built some satellite cabs as well, so I can stick them in other rooms of the house, or out in the shop if I'm up at the cabin, and keep the amp controls with me. Tweak the amps, pedals, while monitoring just the recorded signal, and then record it when I'm happy with what I've got going.
Also, sometimes I just keep the Suhr RL take, because it sounds great. And sometimes I re-amp into the Suhr.
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Post by ninworks on Aug 21, 2023 9:15:55 GMT -6
Re-amping is something I have never done either. I suppose I might have a need if I were recording another guitar player other than myself, but I have never needed to do that for anything I ever played on. I have been playing guitar like someone possessed for over 55 years and recording for 45 of them. If I can't get it right going in then I need to hang it up. I came up through analog tape so I had to learn to do it right the first time. There was no "Fixing it" at the mix stage.
If I ever have the need I have 2 AVID Eleven Racks and I could use either for a re-amping I/O. I'm sure as hell not going to buy something to do that.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 21, 2023 11:13:58 GMT -6
Re-amping is something I have never done either. I suppose I might have a need if I were recording another guitar player other than myself, but I have never needed to do that for anything I ever played on. I have been playing guitar like someone possessed for over 55 years and recording for 45 of them. If I can't get it right going in then I need to hang it up. I came up through analog tape so I had to learn to do it right the first time. There was no "Fixing it" at the mix stage. If I ever have the need I have 2 AVID Eleven Racks and I could use either for a re-amping I/O. I'm sure as hell not going to buy something to do that. For me the issue is that I'm having to choose between keeping my guitar amp out of the vocal mic or keeping the cymbals out of the guitar amp. This is for a project where I'm capturing live rehearsals in a 12x15x10 room so compromises are gonna happen. I'm landing on "take my chances with the cymbal bleed" into the guitar amp's mic but it's dawning on me that for relatively little effort I could fall back on a re-amp plan. Right now the bleed sounds fine, but that's with the guitar flat. If the mix calls for some creative EQ or style-driven compression, I could see it really making the cymbals sound weird. Kind of an "ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" type thing.
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Post by Ward on Aug 21, 2023 11:21:50 GMT -6
Countryman type 85 DI box here as well, and I got a cdkelly Signal Arts re-amp box. Easy Peasy Lemon Sqeazy.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Aug 21, 2023 12:22:09 GMT -6
Countryman DI pre pedals, and it mostly only gets used for when I have to edit something super tight and the overdrive or crazy distortion they have happening at the amp makes it hard to see what’s going on. Really easy to land cut marks in a DI signal, group everything with it and edit away. I’d say less than 5% of the time it gets sent back out to reamp, if need be I’ll use something in the box off the di track.
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Post by Ward on Aug 21, 2023 12:32:34 GMT -6
Countryman DI pre pedals, and it mostly only gets used for when I have to edit something super tight and the overdrive or crazy distortion they have happening at the amp makes it hard to see what’s going on. Really easy to land cut marks in a DI signal, group everything with it and edit away. I’d say less than 5% of the time it gets sent back out to reamp, if need be I’ll use something in the box off the di track. I always end up with ground loops using the approach. What is your first pedal or any other secrets, please?
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 21, 2023 13:09:50 GMT -6
Countryman type 85 DI box here as well, and I got a cdkelly Signal Arts re-amp box. Easy Peasy Lemon Sqeazy. I totally forgot about that SA product. What do you make of Chad's theory that DI signals need to be boosted to drive amps properly? This is definitely against the grain though his explanation makes sense in theory. www.signalartelectronics.com/product-page/signal-art-reamp
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Post by Ward on Aug 21, 2023 15:33:40 GMT -6
Countryman type 85 DI box here as well, and I got a cdkelly Signal Arts re-amp box. Easy Peasy Lemon Sqeazy. I totally forgot about that SA product. What do you make of Chad's theory that DI signals need to be boosted to drive amps properly? This is definitely against the grain though his explanation makes sense in theory. www.signalartelectronics.com/product-page/signal-art-reampI haven't disagreed with Chad on anything audio/electronic yet... why start now? I completely agree with his assertion.
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 21, 2023 15:37:10 GMT -6
I haven't disagreed with Chad on anything audio/electronic yet... why start now? I completely agree with his assertion. Yeah, I've never regretting buying anything Chad has been involved in. But I'm not experienced in this area so I'm going to keep digging. The SAE DI pushes sound out at +10db (6db higher than standard +4) and has an attenuator. Do you find this feature helpful or are just attenuating the signal back down to normal levels anyway?
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Post by jeremygillespie on Aug 21, 2023 15:43:41 GMT -6
Countryman DI pre pedals, and it mostly only gets used for when I have to edit something super tight and the overdrive or crazy distortion they have happening at the amp makes it hard to see what’s going on. Really easy to land cut marks in a DI signal, group everything with it and edit away. I’d say less than 5% of the time it gets sent back out to reamp, if need be I’ll use something in the box off the di track. I always end up with ground loops using the approach. What is your first pedal or any other secrets, please? Batteries in the pedals, or pedal board and amp plugged into the same circuit, ground lift on the Countryman, and those little grey ground lifts on the amp or pedal board if needed. Any combo of those things gets me to a reasonable spot. Sometimes you plug it in and it’s dead quiet, sometimes there is an old beat up fuzz that screws the pooch no matter what you do. If that’s the case when the massive barrage of sound starts up I forget about the buzz.
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Post by Ward on Aug 21, 2023 15:43:50 GMT -6
I haven't disagreed with Chad on anything audio/electronic yet... why start now? I completely agree with his assertion. Yeah, I've never regretting buying anything Chad has been involved in. But I'm not experienced in this area so I'm going to keep digging. The SAE DI pushes sound out at +10db (6db higher than standard +4) and has an attenuator. Do you find this feature helpful or are just attenuating the signal back down to normal levels anyway? I'm attenuating it to where it's manageable in the DAW then compensating as needed on the way back out. So having the extra output available, as needed, is a godsend.
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Post by Ward on Aug 21, 2023 15:44:58 GMT -6
I always end up with ground loops using the approach. What is your first pedal or any other secrets, please? Batteries in the pedals, or pedal board and amp plugged into the same circuit, ground lift on the Countryman, and those little grey ground lifts on the amp or pedal board if needed. Any combo of those things gets me to a reasonable spot. Sometimes you plug it in and it’s dead quiet, sometimes there is an old beat up fuzz that screws the pooch no matter what you do. If that’s the case when the massive barrage of sound starts up I forget about the buzz. More often than not, the pooch gets screwed IME. Maybe I just have terrible luck?
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 21, 2023 17:20:24 GMT -6
Ok, thinking about pulling the trigger on the Little Labs Red Eye, but I'm wondering about something else.
Why wouldn't I just send my output from my pedalboard into the instrument input on my interface (MOTU Ultralight AVB in this room) and then send the line out to something like a Radial ProRMP and then into my amp. I can do that with virtually zero latency in my setup and I'll be hearing what basically is a re-amped signal.
For my purposes (which are to possibly re-amp the guitar if mic bleed in the guitar amp is problematic) wouldn't this be the same function as the Red Eye but at less than 1/2 the cost? And the Red Eye is not prohibitively expensive, but if I did it this way I could afford two setups like this for the room whereas I really can't afford two Red Eye's.
What do you guys think?
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Post by notneeson on Aug 21, 2023 17:38:26 GMT -6
Ok, thinking about pulling the trigger on the Little Labs Red Eye, but I'm wondering about something else. Why wouldn't I just send my output from my pedalboard into the instrument input on my interface (MOTU Ultralight AVB in this room) and then send the line out to something like a Radial ProRMP and then into my amp. I can do that with virtually zero latency in my setup and I'll be hearing what basically is a re-amped signal. For my purposes (which are to possibly re-amp the guitar if mic bleed in the guitar amp is problematic) wouldn't this be the same function as the Red Eye but at less than 1/2 the cost? And the Red Eye is not prohibitively expensive, but if I did it this way I could afford two setups like this for the room whereas I really can't afford two Red Eye's. What do you guys think? Well, then you're inserting an extra round of A/D D/A before the guitar amp, but not the end of the world. How is that better than using a quality DI with a throughput straight to the amp? Maybe I need to read the whole thread?
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Aug 21, 2023 17:45:16 GMT -6
Ok, thinking about pulling the trigger on the Little Labs Red Eye, but I'm wondering about something else. Why wouldn't I just send my output from my pedalboard into the instrument input on my interface (MOTU Ultralight AVB in this room) and then send the line out to something like a Radial ProRMP and then into my amp. I can do that with virtually zero latency in my setup and I'll be hearing what basically is a re-amped signal. For my purposes (which are to possibly re-amp the guitar if mic bleed in the guitar amp is problematic) wouldn't this be the same function as the Red Eye but at less than 1/2 the cost? And the Red Eye is not prohibitively expensive, but if I did it this way I could afford two setups like this for the room whereas I really can't afford two Red Eye's. What do you guys think? Well, then you're inserting an extra round of A/D D/A before the guitar amp, but not the end of the world. How is that better than using a quality DI with a throughput straight to the amp? Maybe I need to read the whole thread? I'm not worried about the extra round of AD/DA in terms of quality (it's gonna get all goofed up by the amp and then shot into a mic anyway) only latency which is negligible here. But what's the benefit? The idea of the Little Labs Red Eye as I understand it is that you can hear exactly what your re-amped signal would sound like since can you use it both as a re-amp and a DI. So for my purposes (which would be to recreate the sound of the amp in the room through re-amping) I was wondering if I would achieve the same thing by using the interface guitar input and then just using a cheaper passive reamp box to the guitar amp. Then I would record the guitar amp of course on its own channel. If it's the same thing, the advantage is simply that I can run two channels like that for $250 instead of $600. Also seems a bit simpler to me in terms of cabling. But the big caveat is I've never done any real re-amping myself. So maybe the proper DI makes a big difference?
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