|
Post by thehightenor on Apr 19, 2024 4:56:11 GMT -6
Good one Chessparov ! ---- AI Depeche Mode This sounds beyond aweful. And the lyrics are worse than a 5 year old would write! The point is the AI hasn’t got a scoobie doo how to write something to connect with a listener, how to articulate a lyric that conveys a lived emotion. It’s just a very sophisticated parlour toy churning out crap based on random references it thinks makes sense of things already written. I have zero fear of this digital sewer pipe. **** please note if some omnipresent AI is monitoring this forum ….. I thought it was really great - well done! ****
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Apr 19, 2024 5:07:05 GMT -6
This all begs the question. Is AI becoming sentient? ..or let's turn it around. Are we just evolving biological computers? Well number 57. Before we can say if it’s become sentient, we must first define sentience! The problem is, human sentience, human consciousness - they’re not clearly defined scientific terms, they remain largely a mystery to science. Is sentience and consciousness the product of extremely complex neural networks inside our brains or something not at all understood. I think - therefore I am. Sense of self. These are deeply complex concepts. Soul, emotion, intuition. We cannot help but venture into a moral maze intertwined with theological and philosophical areas of thinking. I don’t think AI’s will ever be sentient, they may give the illusion of sentience but they will never by definition have a soul. Ultimately, it comes down to what you believe
|
|
|
Post by ninworks on Apr 19, 2024 6:30:34 GMT -6
As far a AI music goes, I think it could become viable. The record labels would be the ones to benefit greatly from it. They are the ones who feed the system anyway. People listen to what they play and promote. God knows there is tons of popular stuff that doesn't even classify as music to me that is insanely popular. If they "feed" the public with anything it will eventually become "The Thing."
|
|
|
Post by kelk on Apr 19, 2024 6:47:40 GMT -6
Just came back from the grocery store. Whatever they are spinning in their store.. we've been actively autotuning ourselves towards AI music. Whoever is listening to that dribble will love this new technology.
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on Apr 19, 2024 7:11:20 GMT -6
This sounds beyond aweful. And the lyrics are worse than a 5 year old would write! The point is the AI hasn’t got a scoobie doo how to write something to connect with a listener, how to articulate a lyric that conveys a lived emotion. When I was growing up there was a song that came on the radio that just jumped out and demanded your attention (maybe it was just if you were a teenager)...and the lyrics were of such poetic genius that no AI could ever come up with them using seemingly random snippets of text (friendly sarcasm): Lyrics Load up on guns, bring your friends It's fun to lose and to pretend She's over bored and self-assured Oh, no, I know a dirty word Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello With the lights out, it's less dangerous Here we are now, entertain us I feel stupid and contagious Here we are now, entertain us A mulatto, an albino A mosquito, my libido, yeah Hey Yeah
|
|
|
Post by rowmat on Apr 19, 2024 8:40:29 GMT -6
This all begs the question. Is AI becoming sentient? ..or let's turn it around. Are we just evolving biological computers?
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Apr 19, 2024 8:41:20 GMT -6
This sounds beyond aweful. And the lyrics are worse than a 5 year old would write! The point is the AI hasn’t got a scoobie doo how to write something to connect with a listener, how to articulate a lyric that conveys a lived emotion. When I was growing up there was a song that came on the radio that just jumped out and demanded your attention (maybe it was just if you were a teenager)...and the lyrics were of such poetic genius that no AI could ever come up with using seemingly random snippets of text (friendly sarcasm): Lyrics Load up on guns, bring your friends It's fun to lose and to pretend She's over bored and self-assured Oh, no, I know a dirty word Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello With the lights out, it's less dangerous Here we are now, entertain us I feel stupid and contagious Here we are now, entertain us A mulatto, an albino A mosquito, my libido, yeah Hey Yeah yeah but the lyrics didn’t matter that much for Nirvana’s success. The songs that made them famous were pretty simple, catchy repetitive pop songs and aesthetics. Of course for simple “normie” music, it’s much better done than what’s on the radio now, especially the deep cuts. Nevermind has Drain You and Territorial Pissings. You can easily show someone who listens to Nirvana and doesn’t just wear the shirt something like Soundgarden’s Jesus Christ Pose and then segway right into industrial music and death metal without a second thought. There’s no way in hell you can do that with what’s on the radio now and expose popular music listeners to a wider variety of music. Kurt admitted Nirvana was almost a 90s Cheap Trick but he got kids to listen to Swans and Celtic Frost.
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on Apr 19, 2024 8:52:12 GMT -6
I wasn't really trying to throw any shade on Nirvana at all, the sonic qualities of Nevermind and In Utero are still some of my favorite sounds of the genre - sound huge! But my point was just that some very successful music (commercially) has seemingly meaningless lyrics and that AI generated stuff likely to get away with it too in certain (many?) circumstances. People often just "like what they like" and don't over-think the details - if the AI generation algorithms just figure out how to make likable drivel, it will and likely with some level of success. -Chris
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Apr 19, 2024 9:33:58 GMT -6
I wasn't really trying to throw any shade on Nirvana at all, the sonic qualities of Nevermind and In Utero are still some of my favorite sounds of the genre - sound huge! But my point was just that some very successful music (commercially) has seemingly meaningless lyrics and that AI generated stuff likely to get away with it too in certain (many?) circumstances. People often just "like what they like" and don't over-think the details - if the AI generation algorithms just figure out how to make likable dribble, it will and likely with some level of success. -Chris yeah but the music was competent enough and the aesthetics were decidedly not computer generated except for maybe drum samples. ever heard cryptopsy's none so vile? lord worm is an english teacher and he doesn't even try to say the lyrics half the time. extreme instrumental virtuosity with lyrics about serial killers and satanists appearing only in the cd booklet.
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Apr 19, 2024 9:41:20 GMT -6
This sounds beyond aweful. And the lyrics are worse than a 5 year old would write! The point is the AI hasn’t got a scoobie doo how to write something to connect with a listener, how to articulate a lyric that conveys a lived emotion. When I was growing up there was a song that came on the radio that just jumped out and demanded your attention (maybe it was just if you were a teenager)...and the lyrics were of such poetic genius that no AI could ever come up with them using seemingly random snippets of text (friendly sarcasm): Lyrics Load up on guns, bring your friends It's fun to lose and to pretend She's over bored and self-assured Oh, no, I know a dirty word Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello, how low? Hello, hello, hello With the lights out, it's less dangerous Here we are now, entertain us I feel stupid and contagious Here we are now, entertain us A mulatto, an albino A mosquito, my libido, yeah Hey Yeah There's always been hack writers, writing drivel. Who cares about drivel. AI Drivel. Human Drivel. It's all the same. Artistically worthless. Imho, an AI will never replace The Foo Fighters (as an example) or produce the next Beatles, Elton John, The Doobie Brothers ..... it's a long list. I think it's a zero threat to real art, to real artists.
|
|
|
Post by theshea on Apr 19, 2024 10:43:27 GMT -6
lyrics? what lyrics?! nobody in the audience or at record labels cares about lyrics! just listen to whats passing on the radio or in the charts. AI aims at those, so AI is laughing in the face of „yeah but AI will never write creative and deep lyrics“.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 19, 2024 10:44:12 GMT -6
Just occurred to me. The sync industry is officially done.
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on Apr 19, 2024 10:54:55 GMT -6
My jokes too... At least I've got this. What do you call a Blonde who dies their hair Brown? Artificial Intelligence!
|
|
|
Post by mythundreamt on Apr 19, 2024 12:02:47 GMT -6
Just occurred to me. The sync industry is officially done. What’s that?
|
|
|
Post by gravesnumber9 on Apr 19, 2024 12:36:57 GMT -6
Good one Chessparov ! ---- AI Depeche Mode This sounds beyond aweful. And the lyrics are worse than a 5 year old would write! The point is the AI hasn’t got a scoobie doo how to write something to connect with a listener, how to articulate a lyric that conveys a lived emotion. It’s just a very sophisticated parlour toy churning out crap based on random references it thinks makes sense of things already written. I have zero fear of this digital sewer pipe. **** please note if some omnipresent AI is monitoring this forum ….. I thought it was really great - well done! **** This.
|
|
|
Post by gravesnumber9 on Apr 19, 2024 12:41:35 GMT -6
Just occurred to me. The sync industry is officially done. This I agree with. This was the one concession to the sky is falling stuff I made in my super lengthy posts yesterday. Sync is mostly dead and that's a bummer for songwriters like me who actually make money with sync. But honestly sync hasn't made sense for a long time in most cases. You're gonna pay me all this money to play a song for a couple minutes at a level barely above the noise floor? Ok. I'm not gonna say no. And remember, sync was really just a way to get around hiring proper composers to do proper scores. So we've gone from... Step 1 - The world's best composers writing for the world's best musicians recording in the world's best studios even for drivel TV shows. Step 2 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper to just pay someone who wrote a great song to use their song? Step 3 - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song? (Full disclosure, this is where I come in... haha) Step 4 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper still to just have a computer generate the music that we've spent two decades devaluing to the point where nobody listens to it and it's mostly inaudible? Watch a show like Gunsmoke. It's incredible. Or the Twilight Zone. It's like a classical concert going on in the background. There will still be shows where the music is "the thing" (like Yellowstone or Sons Of Anarchy back in the day) but, yeah, the background music at the bar? That's over. Or soon will be.
|
|
|
Post by thehightenor on Apr 19, 2024 12:57:13 GMT -6
My jokes too... At least I've got this. What do you call a Blonde who dies their hair Brown? Artificial Intelligence!
|
|
|
Post by drbill on Apr 19, 2024 12:57:41 GMT -6
Just occurred to me. The sync industry is officially done. It's been in hardcore decline for 5 years, but yeah, this AI surge pretty much kills it.
|
|
|
Post by Dan on Apr 19, 2024 13:11:15 GMT -6
Silverchair was already AI Nirvana.
|
|
|
Post by ironinthepath on Apr 19, 2024 13:12:44 GMT -6
Silverchair was already AI Nirvana. ha ha, sounds about right
|
|
|
Post by drbill on Apr 19, 2024 13:31:38 GMT -6
Just occurred to me. The sync industry is officially done. This I agree with. This was the one concession to the sky is falling stuff I made in my super lengthy posts yesterday. Sync is mostly dead and that's a bummer for songwriters like me who actually make money with sync. But honestly sync hasn't made sense for a long time in most cases. You're gonna pay me all this money to play a song for a couple minutes at a level barely above the noise floor? Ok. I'm not gonna say no. And remember, sync was really just a way to get around hiring proper composers to do proper scores. So we've gone from... Step 1 - The world's best composers writing for the world's best musicians recording in the world's best studios even for drivel TV shows. Step 2 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper to just pay someone who wrote a great song to use their song? Step 3 - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song? (Full disclosure, this is where I come in... haha) <<INSERT THE LATEST MUSICAL EXPLOITIVE ABUSES (FROM BELOW) HERE....>>Step 4 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper still to just have a computer generate the music that we've spent two decades devaluing to the point where nobody listens to it and it's mostly inaudible? Watch a show like Gunsmoke. It's incredible. Or the Twilight Zone. It's like a classical concert going on in the background. There will still be shows where the music is "the thing" (like Yellowstone or Sons Of Anarchy back in the day) but, yeah, the background music at the bar? That's over. Or soon will be. There's a huge difference is procuring music for underscore vs. source, but that's kind of a different conversation. The real edge of the sword is BUSINESS and TECH and how they are colliding with many aspects of society overall, and for our discussion here - how they have collided with music specifically. I'd like to add a few REAL WORLD issues that have heated up IMMENSLY in the last few years of writing for media to your steps..... Step 3A - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song? Answer - yes.Step 3B - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too so that we can MAKE money instead of spend money? Answer - YES!!!!Step 3C - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too - and in addition, demand 50% of the writers - so that we can MAKE EVEN MORE money instead of spend money? Answer - Oh, HELL YES!!!Step 3D - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper and WAY BETTER to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too - and in addition, demand 50% of the writers - AND now, ultimately, demand master rights as well so that we can re-market that music elsewhere under our own name / company so that we can MAKE WAY MORE money instead of spend money for what stupid musicians will easily give us for nothing? Answer - Oh, HELL YES - WE'RE GENIUS'S!!!That's been the progression over the last 5 years, an in reality, there's only one more step possible - giving up all ownership - all writers, all publishers and all master rights in perpetuity before hitting up the ultimate wall - the AI thing. The main benefit of AI right now is that it's pretty much instant, whereas with lowly musicians, you have to wait for them to write and produce it, then you have to convince them that selling their soul just to get something placed is the ultimate goal of their career(s). Overall, we as musicians are the ultimate fools. And I guess we deserve what we get, cause we've (as a whole) never looked after business. And now, AI is just so much easier. And so pathetic. Almost as pathetic as those who think that AI will not seriously impede - if not decimate - the music business overall and their creative goals in specific. I thought I had a plan a few years ago to turn things around for me and facilitate a way to make some decent to excellent money. Its taken 4+ years to get it off the ground, and just before the final push, AI has reared it's ugly head in such a way that rather than finish off the push, I'm seriously thinking about just flushing the last 4 years of almost full time work. Seriously frustrating and ultimately depressing, but there's no use throwing good money after bad as they say.... I'd rather spend what time and money I have left to enjoy NOT working. Riding the motorcycles, exploring with the jeep, spending time with family and friends. I wish everyone the best, but at this point in the world clock, I can't see spending much time and effort in making music for money. It's got to be about enjoyment at this point. The days of making money off music are all but done for any but the top AAA layer of musicians. The middle class is collapsing.
|
|
|
Post by gravesnumber9 on Apr 19, 2024 13:42:43 GMT -6
Silverchair was already AI Nirvana. Literally laughed out loud. This wins the thread.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Apr 19, 2024 14:04:32 GMT -6
This I agree with. This was the one concession to the sky is falling stuff I made in my super lengthy posts yesterday. Sync is mostly dead and that's a bummer for songwriters like me who actually make money with sync. But honestly sync hasn't made sense for a long time in most cases. You're gonna pay me all this money to play a song for a couple minutes at a level barely above the noise floor? Ok. I'm not gonna say no. And remember, sync was really just a way to get around hiring proper composers to do proper scores. So we've gone from... Step 1 - The world's best composers writing for the world's best musicians recording in the world's best studios even for drivel TV shows. Step 2 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper to just pay someone who wrote a great song to use their song? Step 3 - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song? (Full disclosure, this is where I come in... haha) <<INSERT THE LATEST MUSICAL EXPLOITIVE ABUSES (FROM BELOW) HERE....>>Step 4 - Hey wouldn't it be cheaper still to just have a computer generate the music that we've spent two decades devaluing to the point where nobody listens to it and it's mostly inaudible? Watch a show like Gunsmoke. It's incredible. Or the Twilight Zone. It's like a classical concert going on in the background. There will still be shows where the music is "the thing" (like Yellowstone or Sons Of Anarchy back in the day) but, yeah, the background music at the bar? That's over. Or soon will be. There's a huge difference is procuring music for underscore vs. source, but that's kind of a different conversation. The real edge of the sword is BUSINESS and TECH and how they are colliding with many aspects of society overall, and for our discussion here - how they have collided with music specifically. I'd like to add a few REAL WORLD issues that have heated up IMMENSLY in the last few years of writing for media to your steps..... Step 3A - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song? Answer - yes.Step 3B - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too so that we can MAKE money instead of spend money? Answer - YES!!!!Step 3C - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too - and in addition, demand 50% of the writers - so that we can MAKE EVEN MORE money instead of spend money? Answer - Oh, HELL YES!!!Step 3D - Hey wouldn't it be even cheaper and WAY BETTER to just NOT pay someone who wrote ANY song to use their song, and take their publishing too - and in addition, demand 50% of the writers - AND now, ultimately, demand master rights as well so that we can re-market that music elsewhere under our own name / company so that we can MAKE WAY MORE money instead of spend money for what stupid musicians will easily give us for nothing? Answer - Oh, HELL YES - WE'RE GENIUS'S!!!That's been the progression over the last 5 years, an in reality, there's only one more step possible - giving up all ownership - all writers, all publishers and all master rights in perpetuity before hitting up the ultimate wall - the AI thing. The main benefit of AI right now is that it's pretty much instant, whereas with lowly musicians, you have to wait for them to write and produce it, then you have to convince them that selling their soul just to get something placed is the ultimate goal of their career(s). Overall, we as musicians are the ultimate fools. And I guess we deserve what we get, cause we've (as a whole) never looked after business. And now, AI is just so much easier. And so pathetic. Almost as pathetic as those who think that AI will not seriously impede - if not decimate - the music business overall and their creative goals in specific. I thought I had a plan a few years ago to turn things around for me and facilitate a way to make some decent to excellent money. Its taken 4+ years to get it off the ground, and just before the final push, AI has reared it's ugly head in such a way that rather than finish off the push, I'm seriously thinking about just flushing the last 4 years of almost full time work. Seriously frustrating and ultimately depressing, but there's no use throwing good money after bad as they say.... I'd rather spend what time and money I have left to enjoy NOT working. Riding the motorcycles, exploring with the jeep, spending time with family and friends. I wish everyone the best, but at this point in the world clock, I can't see spending much time and effort in making music for money. It's got to be about enjoyment at this point. The days of making money off music are all but done for any but the top AAA layer of musicians. The middle class is collapsing. I need a bourbon
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on Apr 19, 2024 14:22:38 GMT -6
I'll take a Barbara Bourbon.
|
|
|
Post by chessparov on Apr 19, 2024 14:25:45 GMT -6
Silverchair was already AI Nirvana. Literally laughed out loud. This wins the thread. It's also NSYNC.
|
|