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Post by rowmat on Jun 11, 2024 19:04:33 GMT -6
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Post by Johnkenn on Jun 11, 2024 19:47:44 GMT -6
There’s totally a “tell”. I hear it as the occasional warble or smear…and everything is just too perfect. But it’s just a matter of time.
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Post by rowmat on Jun 11, 2024 19:56:57 GMT -6
There’s totally a “tell”. I hear it as the occasional warble or smear…and everything is just too perfect. But it’s just a matter of time. Yeah about two weeks I reckon.
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Post by drbill on Jun 12, 2024 9:59:21 GMT -6
That was incredibly sobering and depressing it's made substantial gains in the last 2 months......
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Post by christopher on Jun 12, 2024 10:34:37 GMT -6
It’s got a hollow comb filtering vocal thing. Probably a text to speech algo, + autotune to fit a scale, + boatloads of doubling and modulation plugins.. then multiple tracks of this to make a fake vocal stack.
For the backing tracks, take a library of music notation, feed it all to midi, divide it into verse/chorus/intro etc, labels as genre. Run it through templates with VI’s. That’s how I’d do it if I knew programming and endless computing.
Its pretty crazy it’s all automated at this point.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 12, 2024 10:37:32 GMT -6
I haven’t read most of this thread, I checked out a while back, it’s was way too depressing. I’ve been honestly struggling with it. The only morbid consolation I have is that AI is destroying/altering/eliminating/upsetting just about every industry. I’d hate to be a graphic designer, copy writer, lawyer, fast food worker, etc etc.
I don’t know what to do…maybe I’ll take up distilling whisky, that way I can at least drink myself happy when our AI overlords come to kill is all.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 12, 2024 10:39:58 GMT -6
I saw a meme somewhere that said “I wanted AI to do my laundry and clean the dishes so that I could make art. Instead AI is making art so that I can do the laundry and clean the dishes”.
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Post by christopher on Jun 12, 2024 10:43:13 GMT -6
I forgot about that Eleven labs vocal thing.. now THAT was crazy!
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Post by geoff738 on Jun 12, 2024 12:21:30 GMT -6
Just listened to the Beato thing on my ipad. I couldn’t tell. Ugh.
Cheers, Geoff
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Post by rowmat on Jun 12, 2024 14:39:57 GMT -6
And here’s what’s really scary that’s already coming down the pike.
While I’m using YouTube as an example it applies to pretty much anything including obviously music.
Currently an increasing number of ‘recommended’ YouTube videos that appear in your feed are created completely by AI.
From my recent experience I would say around 50% of all YouTube videos appearing in my feed are AI generated.
And these AI video’s use content obtained/stolen(?) from other user created videos and edited often using some kind of frame around the video content (sometimes mirror reversed) and typically with poorly executed speech to text. Often Wikipedia excerpts are included if relevant.
That may not bother some as YouTube has been doing this for years (though not specifically AI) based upon users search history even if they are not logged in.
These recommended videos whether AI or not are taken from the existing YouTube video database. Many of these videos maybe several years old.
Remember YouTube is owned by Google which also collects user data from internet browsing history, along with Gmail, texts, phone, cloud etc, etc, etc. Everything! But hey include Apple, Microsoft whoever you like.
So big tech knows more about us, our habits, likes, dislikes etc than we know about ourselves.
Most have heard of ‘bots’ which masquerade as users in various social media feeds. It has been reported that on some popular social media platforms bots now exceed actual people.
With that in mind picture a scenario (using YouTube just as an example) where an AI video is created within seconds based upon all your individual personal data as you browse the net and then that video is fed into your stream as being recommended.
Not only is this new video using your own data but it is created around your most recent/current search history.
So if you’re looking for say investment related information online, a video or a webpage/website could be created literally on the fly and fed into your feed in almost realtime that is extremely persuasive as it appears to tick all the boxes you have been wanting.
Not only that but this newly created AI video has had it’s creation date and number of subscribers spoofed to fool you into thinking it’s been around a lot longer than a few minutes and the comments section full of positive comments is also completely fake.
This can also apply to news, politics anything.
So who is likely to be behind the majority of all this?
Some pimply faced kid in a hoodie in his parents basement doing it for kicks? Maybe.
But if the tech platform itself is creating most of this AI content and prioritising it over other user created content then that’s more profit for the tech giants.
Not only that but the ability to use this as another means of further dividing and grinding middle class into the ground based upon what has been patently demonstrated in the past few years is obvious.
The ability to manipulate people has just increased exponentially.
The ability for exploitation has likewise also increased exponentially.
This is where it is all heading.
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Post by christophert on Jun 12, 2024 15:12:45 GMT -6
Rick's video is worrying - the AI tracks are really surprising. Bye bye Spotify < which will be filled with AI content in no time.
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Post by rowmat on Jun 12, 2024 15:15:17 GMT -6
Rick's video is worrying - the AI tracks are really surprising. Bye bye Spotify < which will be filled with AI content in no time. It already is according to a previous Beato video. The biggest Spotify content creator (by far) was linked to Spotify itself.
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Post by drbill on Jun 12, 2024 15:17:53 GMT -6
^^^^^^ Indeed ^^^^^^^
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Post by mcirish on Jun 12, 2024 15:36:39 GMT -6
I watched the Beato video just now. AI has come a long way very quickly. The sad thing is that many people are fine with "fake" everything. Nothing has to be real or tangible. No physical medium to play music on has sort of led music to becoming a worthless subscription to play anything that's ever come out. Nothing is tangible now, including the artists. Technology has let people with very little inate talent become stars, or at least influencers. I feel like an old man yelling at the clouds or something. Bottom line is that younger people don't want to pay for anything, which makes being an artist non-profitable. The best we can do is write for ourselve and find as many like minded people we can to listen. But, I don't think it will be the masses anymore. People have become very non-discerning. They just don't care if it's real or not because they don't place any value on music to begin with.
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Post by rowmat on Jun 12, 2024 15:43:50 GMT -6
Howard Beale had a crystal ball.
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Post by viciousbliss on Jun 12, 2024 17:32:32 GMT -6
I was just thinking about how I could use AI to finish writing songs since it's been almost impossible to find band members for the last 15 years. People were 10x more driven to form bands and write songs in 2001 or even 2005 compared to 2008 and later. I'm sure the drive was even higher in the 90s and earlier. Reading about Disturbed and what they did. Everyone in that band was driven. Musicians like that, in my experience, are incredibly rare to find. The majority of the guys I've dealt with just slopped down whatever, started playing one of the zillions of bars that used to be around here, and thought they were bigtime. Even though no one was into the shows and the majority of the audience was just texting on their phones and doing whatever else the whole time. A lot of guys just wanted someone else to do everything. Write the songs, play the solos, etc. Lots of guys who want the perks but don't want to put in the work. Never have I met so many delusional narcissists than I did when I talked to guys off musician ads. Liars too. "Oh, what you've got in mind is exactly what we're trying to do". Then you go there and their music is nothing like they said and they treat you like a puppet to order around. Or they try to pass off a cover song as one of theirs and it was the only compelling thing that they played. Just so many desperate, antisocial losers trying to use music to make themselves feel like a big deal. Then when you do have band members, you deal with guys who are incredibly disruptive, are constantly on the look out for other bands to join, etc. So, if AI could take the place of terrible band members, that would be a big relief. There is a tell with the AI. It sounds less clear, more rudimentary than regular music. The vocals are simpler than what a person would do. But it's still about 85% of the way there towards matching today's computerized Pop music. 6-12 months from now, it will be much better. It's probably good enough for the average person who sees music as background music for their social life. The future is going to be people making their own songs with apps on their phone. I can totally see all the women I follow on IG and Snap typing in what they want the lyrics to be and selecting some algorithm for the music style. Right now they use music as an extension of what they want to express about their lives to their audience. In the past, people would seek out music they could relate to to cope with their lives. So, it's almost like a lot of people are becoming vicarious performers. Society has already become so corrupted. So many people have lost the interest in or ability to have legit conversations. They're mainly interested in whatever things on their phone cater to their base instincts. Tech-dependence is making a lot of people more primitive as they decide to let tech do more for them and let social media do their thinking. The average person isn't interested in music with the seriousness they were in the 90s. Even as far back as 1998, it was incredibly easy to find serious music people to have these in-depth discussions with. On the plus side, I was just reading something from Peter Diamandis and Fountain Life about using AI for advanced cancer detection and all this stuff. OpenCRISP-1 sounds phenomenal. This is something that is going to have a lot of positive effects on health and medicine. There's just so much stuff that's advancing as rapidly as AI in music that will make things a lot better. For those that want to go backwards in time, the only way to achieve that is to go forwards. Tech progressing faster and faster is revealing the big picture more clearly. The future is a society where we can largely do what we want with our time, resources are abundant, major problems are all solved, and we can customize everything even down to the type of society we want. There will still probably be Amish communities. Probably some communities where you can make it static, keep it stuck in a year like 1995 but have the advanced hospitals so you don't have people suffering with things like paralysis or dying of things that would be preventable in the year 2035 or 2040 or whenever. And probably cars that don't crash so you don't have that. I'm not sure why someone would want to recreate the past while also keeping the bad parts. Read up on it yourselves. More and more companies, governments, colleges, etc are coming up with new takes on the same emerging exponential tech that it's becoming harder to predict exactly what is going to happen next. It's easier to predict what is going to be possible. www.fanaticalfuturist.com/2024/05/profluents-open-source-ai-crispr-tool-brings-gene-editing-to-the-masses/
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Post by M57 on Jun 13, 2024 14:15:35 GMT -6
In a strange way things may be kind of circling back to the way it was only a little more than 100 years ago, when you either made music yourself or you went out to see others play. In the future, this may very well be he only way to know if music is made by humans. It's not hard for me to envision a future with AI bands/soloists; and they will "make" videos and have all the trappings of real bands like swag, etc.
These last 100 years have been quite the ride, but they are sure to be a blip in the evolution of the 'business' of music. We have all but forgotten that it was only a few hundred years ago that the basic concept of music ownership came about. Other than performing live, the only way to make money as a musician was to perform or gain a commission from a patron of the arts. And after that, your music was out there, free game for anyone. And it was only some 200 years ago that a musician of Beethoven's stature (indeed, it was Beethoven) was able to negotiate a percentage of sales. Imagine the outrage in the publishing community!
Yes, the "industry" is in for another major upheaval, but one thing that seems to consistently be true is that the winner in all of this craziness has been the listening public, who's options at every turn have grown exponentially. You can moan and groan and claim there will be no incentive for us lowly humans to write music anymore, much less learn how to play an instrument, but you'll be wrong.
One silver lining/takeaway that I got from the Beato video was that his children were aware of what was happening in ways that surprised Rick. No doubt, there will always be a percentage of the population that will eschew AI generated art, and they will spend their money to make sure that what they consume is not AI generated. I.e, go to live concerts, etc.
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Post by M57 on Jun 13, 2024 14:23:36 GMT -6
I might add that a large section of the industry is getting it's just desserts. Most of the music out there is four-chord loop-de-loop, four on the floor, sing-song five note repetitive melodies and lyrics about the same things over and over. If AI can fix that, I may actually start listening to music again.
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Post by viciousbliss on Jun 13, 2024 15:34:04 GMT -6
I might add that a large section of the industry is getting it's just desserts. Most of the music out there is four-chord loop-de-loop, four on the floor, sing-song five note repetitive melodies and lyrics about the same things over and over. If AI can fix that, I may actually start listening to music again. Musicians and engineers might aim to start making stuff more organic in ways that the AI of the day can't duplicate. But it really boils down to what the public wants. Music does not serve the role that it did in prior decades. Before social media and all this, sometimes music was the only support a lot of people had. And you had to be an artist with a big voice to have any influence in society at all unless you were in government, were some other kinda celebrity, or some business tycoon. Nowadays an average person can go viral with one 3 minute video and have an instant influence over society overnight. So, what does the public want music for? A lot of it is a desire to use it as a mechanism to feed their own social media-fueled narcissism. Social media has already brought so much havoc onto society that new technology has to be brought in to replace what's been lost to it. You're never going to have legit real interactions as the norm so long as we have social media. Narcissism and cheap stunts are the norm now. AI will kill this problem because no one will be able to go online and get endless amounts of attention. The attitude will be "so what, my phone and computer already generated an awesome video". All these influencers will become obsolete. AI girlfriends should be a serious dent in the "do what I want or I will go on the dating apps and find me a man that will in five minutes". We could see live music scenes pop back up too. A lot of the reason people aren't forming bands so much now is that it takes too much time and effort without their being a reward. Once prices plummet and people don't have to work much, people can focus more on music. A lot of bands that formed decades ago were able to precisely because the economies were better and there was less risk involved. In some countries they could even get some kinda government benefits to live on while they tried to make it or even other arts funding as I understand it. I'm not too worried about AI because the current society is already pretty horrendous when it comes to music and socializing.
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Post by ragan on Jun 13, 2024 15:51:02 GMT -6
Pop artists/producers have been feverishly trying to make themselves sound like computers for a long time. Meanwhile AI has been rapidly evolving to sound like humans. If they meet in the middle and destroy the pop music business, you won’t find me shedding any tears.
Let them eat cake.
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Post by drbill on Jun 13, 2024 16:19:29 GMT -6
Musicians and engineers might aim to start making stuff more organic in ways that the AI of the day can't duplicate. Just a FYI - right now, today, AI is doing killer organic based musics - blues, folk, jazz. It's not all about pop oriented music.
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Post by rowmat on Jun 13, 2024 16:45:16 GMT -6
Musicians and engineers might aim to start making stuff more organic in ways that the AI of the day can't duplicate. Just a FYI - right now, today, AI is doing killer organic based musics - blues, folk, jazz. It's not all about pop oriented music. Yep… soundcloud.com/rs-539916550/soul-of-the-machine
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Post by rowmat on Jun 13, 2024 17:07:03 GMT -6
Those ‘consumers’ born especially in the last decade and moving forward won’t care one IOTA how/where/why/by whom or what the music, movies, etc they listen to or watch are created.
If they like something that’s all that matters. They won’t by lying awake at night lamenting about a bunch of ageing boomers crying in their beer because they and their musical creations are no longer relevant.
IMO the focus needs to be on nurturing real artists and promoting the concept that real music played by real humans is actually hip/trendy/cool etc.
AI generated ‘art’ isn’t suddenly going away but it may lead to a resurgence in consumers become increasingly interested in something more organic as the resurgence in various forms of analog media such as vinyl and film photography has shown.
The difficulty without some form of regulation will be in knowing what is AI and what isn’t. Because if you think some of it is pretty convincing now you ain’t seen nothin’ yet!
Is the future all about living in a pod with a VR headset permanently attached to your face?
That’s ultimately the question.
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Post by ragan on Jun 13, 2024 17:26:02 GMT -6
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Post by M57 on Jun 13, 2024 17:33:19 GMT -6
Other than that Carolina-O example. I haven't heard anything that's anywhere near killer. Maybe that's good enough for commercial work, but when I try using these sites I get slivers of reasonable music but no continuity and poor structure.. As far as I can tell, these engines can't take direction when it comes to form.. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems all the prompts are of a stylistic nature.. E.g. moody, trap, pop, smooth, smooth jazz, soaring guitars, American female vocal, etc. When asking AI to 'extend' the idea, you can't tell it how. What am I missing. Can someone give me links to AI music that has structure?
When you give it lyrics, Udio's IA is routinely unable to match the appropriate harmonic and melodic cadences with lyrical phrases and rhyme schemes.
Right now I'm listening to a bunch of "Staff Picks" from the Udio site. They 'sound' good, have all the elements of their respective genres, but they all just seem to ramble to me. Blues has all the pentatonic guitar licks down, but nothing sticks out. The jazz music soloists make questionable phrasing and poor chord scale choices. And everything sounds OVER-produced.
I'm still waiting for the good stuff..
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