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Post by wiz on Feb 17, 2016 18:16:08 GMT -6
damn Chris just read about the firmware dilemma... my sympathies man...
Wiz
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Post by swartzfeger on Feb 17, 2016 21:43:02 GMT -6
No he sold his interface and seemed to think he only need the svartbox but maybe I misunderstood ? I alway have trouble with testical details so I let my girlfriend handle that stuff  Yeah, you misunderstood but I probably didn't explain well either. I'm hoping that a new blackface Apollo + a Svart will give me the best of both worlds -- tracking with UA/Unison and low-latency, while having premium converters. I was going to either go with a MOTU or Ensemble interface for the conversion, but I would be missing out on the UA plugs (yes, I could get a satellite, but would miss out on Unison). So the Svart and the Apollo sound like a great combo to me (now I'm kicking myself for not jumping on the end of 2015 UA promo, but oh well!) For the record -- yep, understood that I need a interface in tandem with a Svart... preferably an interface with a BIG ASS VOLUME KNOB (j/k) thanks for the welcome aboard |
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 18, 2016 8:06:31 GMT -6
yes that works and JK is using the svartbox with a SF Apollo.
You can run the SB on spdif which sets up easily with the Apollo and you can set the spdif as inputs in Console and the apollo right hand rotary acts as your volume control and can be manipulated manually or from the DAW.
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Post by svart on Feb 18, 2016 9:13:41 GMT -6
So I tried a few things, mainly tried swapping PCBs on the hard drive, but still clicking.. I suppose the failure is with the headstack or the preamp that is mounted on the head armature. Some drives keep portions of firmware on the disc itself, so that when the drive boots, it seeks for the information, which is what I think the clicking is, the drive searching for info, but the heads aren't working so it never actually starts up.
So I suppose the only thing left to try is swapping the platter to a good drive. I bought a used, but working drive of the same model and revision, so I hope to test it out when it arrives, then swap the old platter into it.
The drive has a single platter and the heads park on ramps off of the disc, thankfully. It's almost going to be easy.. It also looks like the inner 3/16" and outer 1/8" of the disc is not used, as this is where the platter mount and head ramps cover, so I don't have to worry so much about touching the very edges.
I talked with a couple data recovery places and they weren't optimistic about their own chances for success. It seems I have about the same chance of success as they do.
I guess I feel that I'd rather be the one to screw this up instead of paying 1500$ for someone else to screw it up.
I'll be sure to document the process for all to see though!
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Post by tonycamphd on Feb 18, 2016 10:14:43 GMT -6
Nutz! This is terrible and fascinating at the same time, go get it man!!!
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 18, 2016 11:42:31 GMT -6
Pics , we need pics, yuu are the diy guy ?
Honestly we all run the risk of this happening at some point would love to see things that you are describing ? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2016 12:05:09 GMT -6
Yepp... Clicking harddrives that don't start anymore normally means that the start sector is not found and the head beats against the inner edge where the spindle is. If you additionally hear a scratching sound...little chances... The clicking head can be following things: - head physically damaged due to physical shock while the drive is in use. (notebooks...) It can be disconnected from the arm if there was a weak bonding failed. Can happen... - reading unit damaged (due to electrostatic conditions or similar---). There is no reading data coming and the heads bump against the inner edge in the search modus, too, clicking. - VCM driver failure. Movement of the head is erroneous, it doesn't move at all and/or clicks against the spindle from time to time. - head crash. Name says it, head crashed into the platter i.e. had contact. It's only nanometers between them in normal condition AFAIK. Damage of the platter. - damage of mechanics / motor. - damaged sectors that are tried to get read over and over, resulting in clicking, can be that unfortunate that the disk doesn't even startup. - virtual memory mapping on a full hard disk. Can make such sounds. I guess this can be excluded as a root cause here... Unfortunately the recovery specialists are most probably right with the bad prognosis. Not much chances to get data from the disc when you hear it clicking and it isn't recognized/doesn't start up ... Huge portion of luck needed.  |
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Post by svart on Feb 18, 2016 13:11:17 GMT -6
Yepp... Clicking harddrives that don't start anymore normally means that the start sector is not found and the head beats against the inner edge where the spindle is. If you additionally hear a scratching sound...little chances... The clicking head can be following things: - head physically damaged due to physical shock while the drive is in use. (notebooks...) It can be disconnected from the arm if there was a weak bonding failed. Can happen... - reading unit damaged (due to electrostatic conditions or similar---). There is no reading data coming and the heads bump against the inner edge in the search modus, too, clicking. - VCM driver failure. Movement of the head is erroneous, it doesn't move at all and/or clicks against the spindle from time to time. - head crash. Name says it, head crashed into the platter i.e. had contact. It's only nanometers between them in normal condition AFAIK. Damage of the platter. - damage of mechanics / motor. - damaged sectors that are tried to get read over and over, resulting in clicking, can be that unfortunate that the disk doesn't even startup. - virtual memory mapping on a full hard disk. Can make such sounds. I guess this can be excluded as a root cause here... Unfortunately the recovery specialists are most probably right with the bad prognosis. Not much chances to get data from the disc when you hear it clicking and it isn't recognized/doesn't start up ... Huge portion of luck needed. Well, I opened it up for a peek, and the heads never touch the spindle. The clicking is the heads parking on the ramps and then unramping to read, then parking again, etc. The motor works OK. I see no physical damage, no scratches or anything on the face of the platter. The drive never shows up in BIOS or in windows via SATA-USB adapters, but a known good spare PCB on the broken drive does the same exact thing, clicks and doesn't show in BIOS. Overall, i think swapping the platter might work, IF i can swap it out without damage. |
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Post by svart on Feb 18, 2016 13:12:42 GMT -6
Pics , we need pics, yuu are the diy guy ?
Honestly we all run the risk of this happening at some point would love to see things that you are describing ? I'll take pics of as much as I can. When I swap the platter out, I need to do it fast as possible so that no excess dust gets on it. If dust gets on the face of the disc and then between the head and the disc itself, then it's game over. |
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 18, 2016 13:15:44 GMT -6
cool doc what you can or just describe a step !
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Post by jcoutu1 on Feb 18, 2016 13:37:22 GMT -6
Pics , we need pics, yuu are the diy guy ?
Honestly we all run the risk of this happening at some point would love to see things that you are describing ? I'll take pics of as much as I can. When I swap the platter out, I need to do it fast as possible so that no excess dust gets on it. If dust gets on the face of the disc and then between the head and the disc itself, then it's game over. Set up a video camera on a tripod before you do the surgery. Sounds pretty rad. |
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Post by svart on Feb 18, 2016 13:55:37 GMT -6
I'll take pics of as much as I can. When I swap the platter out, I need to do it fast as possible so that no excess dust gets on it. If dust gets on the face of the disc and then between the head and the disc itself, then it's game over. Set up a video camera on a tripod before you do the surgery. Sounds pretty rad. LOL, OK. I had no idea you guys would be so interested in it. |
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Post by svart on Feb 19, 2016 13:59:18 GMT -6
Well, talk about a crazy day.
I came in, and the donor drive was here, so i decided to go ahead and give the swap a try.
I tested the donor, worked fine.
I cracked them both open, and with gloves and carefulness, I swapped the discs out in a couple minutes.
I attached the drive to the USB adapter and it WORKED.
Well, as soon as I go to open the folders..
"You do not have permission, would you like permanent access?"
Yes, please.
Well, the process went on for an hour, and then stalled. Disk not responsive.
Rebooted, and got "not accessable, invalid parameter" on the one partition of the 3 I absolutely needed to get into.
So, unless a miracle happens, I'm pretty sure this is fucked. I tried a few recovery softwares, but none seem to be able to do anything with that partition. CHKDSK can't get beyond 3% either, but at least it identifies the drive now.
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Post by svart on Feb 20, 2016 12:45:09 GMT -6
SUCCESS!
I was able to find a utility that allowed me to drill down into the partition and find all the files, for both work and the converters!
A quick check seems to show that they are intact and working. I'll be able to check more later though.
So between swapping platters and this utility (TestDisk), I've got my stuff back!
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Post by swartzfeger on Feb 20, 2016 13:44:12 GMT -6
SUCCESS! I was able to find a utility that allowed me to drill down into the partition and find all the files, for both work and the converters! A quick check seems to show that they are intact and working. I'll be able to check more later though. So between swapping platters and this utility (TestDisk), I've got my stuff back! BACKUP!!!  This is great news, Chris! |
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Post by kcatthedog on Feb 20, 2016 13:44:52 GMT -6
BACK THOSE FUCKERS UP !!!!!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2016 14:23:54 GMT -6
Great!  |
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Post by drsax on Feb 20, 2016 16:21:13 GMT -6
Awesome news Chris!!
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Post by Johnkenn on Feb 20, 2016 16:43:27 GMT -6
Sweet!
Although, I was really banking on selling my Svartbox Unobtanium for $6700. THAT should be the name.
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Post by wiz on Feb 20, 2016 19:01:13 GMT -6
send me a copy, I will archive it here for you if you want.
cheers
Wiz
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Post by svart on Feb 20, 2016 19:44:52 GMT -6
Sweet! Although, I was really banking on selling my Svartbox Unobtanium for $6700. THAT should be the name. I'll be glad to sell you another one for 6700.. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2016 13:41:05 GMT -6
The price went up fast...  |
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Post by svart on Feb 21, 2016 14:11:01 GMT -6
So I didn't really get any pics or video, the swap took less than 2 minutes and I was itching to get the thing done.. I did get one pic of the internals of my test drive in case anyone was wondering. Attachment DeletedThe triangular thing pointing down is the head armature. The heads are tiny little specs on the end. The orange thing is the head ramp. There are little guides on the ends of the head armatures that ride up the ramps to take the heads off the disc when not in use. The platter is, of course, the shiny disk. In this pic I had already taken the retainer off the disc. It was held on by one torqued screw. I literally just wedged some paper between the head armature and the disk to keep it from touching, then took some paper and wedged up the disc so I could grab it with my fingers (in rubber gloves). Installation is simply the reverse, I put some paper on the head armature and slid the disc in and tightened down the retainer and put the lid back on the drive. Getting it done quickly was necessity so I didn't risk getting dust and lint in the drive. If even a spec got on the disk and wedged under the heads while spinning, it could have destroyed the disc surface and the heads, and likely the data. Drives sure have gotten simple in modern times. There are very few separate parts in the drive unlike those of just 5 years ago that had dozens. |
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Post by wiz on Feb 21, 2016 16:07:48 GMT -6
So I didn't really get any pics or video, the swap took less than 2 minutes and I was itching to get the thing done.. I did get one pic of the internals of my test drive in case anyone was wondering. The triangular thing pointing down is the head armature. The heads are tiny little specs on the end. The orange thing is the head ramp. There are little guides on the ends of the head armatures that ride up the ramps to take the heads off the disc when not in use. The platter is, of course, the shiny disk. In this pic I had already taken the retainer off the disc. It was held on by one torqued screw. I literally just wedged some paper between the head armature and the disk to keep it from touching, then took some paper and wedged up the disc so I could grab it with my fingers (in rubber gloves). Installation is simply the reverse, I put some paper on the head armature and slid the disc in and tightened down the retainer and put the lid back on the drive. Getting it done quickly was necessity so I didn't risk getting dust and lint in the drive. If even a spec got on the disk and wedged under the heads while spinning, it could have destroyed the disc surface and the heads, and likely the data. Drives sure have gotten simple in modern times. There are very few separate parts in the drive unlike those of just 5 years ago that had dozens. I used to work on hard drives, the size of a small car wheel 8) Three in a unit, about the size of a washing machine... Every six months I would have to go replace the belts in them, which meant lifting them out.. .the drives IIRC were about 60Meg... LOL One place, had about 250 of them!!! I nearly died of shock when I saw someone hot swap a SCSI Drive that was 3 1/2 inches wide into a rack sitting on a table and the drive might have been 500Meg (or 250) I was dumb founded cheers Wiz |
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Post by svart on Feb 21, 2016 18:15:28 GMT -6
So I didn't really get any pics or video, the swap took less than 2 minutes and I was itching to get the thing done.. I did get one pic of the internals of my test drive in case anyone was wondering. The triangular thing pointing down is the head armature. The heads are tiny little specs on the end. The orange thing is the head ramp. There are little guides on the ends of the head armatures that ride up the ramps to take the heads off the disc when not in use. The platter is, of course, the shiny disk. In this pic I had already taken the retainer off the disc. It was held on by one torqued screw. I literally just wedged some paper between the head armature and the disk to keep it from touching, then took some paper and wedged up the disc so I could grab it with my fingers (in rubber gloves). Installation is simply the reverse, I put some paper on the head armature and slid the disc in and tightened down the retainer and put the lid back on the drive. Getting it done quickly was necessity so I didn't risk getting dust and lint in the drive. If even a spec got on the disk and wedged under the heads while spinning, it could have destroyed the disc surface and the heads, and likely the data. Drives sure have gotten simple in modern times. There are very few separate parts in the drive unlike those of just 5 years ago that had dozens. I used to work on hard drives, the size of a small car wheel 8) Three in a unit, about the size of a washing machine... Every six months I would have to go replace the belts in them, which meant lifting them out.. .the drives IIRC were about 60Meg... LOL One place, had about 250 of them!!! I nearly died of shock when I saw someone hot swap a SCSI Drive that was 3 1/2 inches wide into a rack sitting on a table and the drive might have been 500Meg (or 250) I was dumb founded cheers Wiz I think I still might have the first HDD I bought in 94-ish.. 1GB drive cost me like 200$. Now you can get a 2TB drive for 100$. Crazy eh? |
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