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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 13, 2024 9:22:27 GMT -6
Guess I’m about to compare to my Trinnov…I’ve done it a couple of times with the software and always end up preferring the Trinnov…here’s to hoping that changes.
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kcatthedog
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Post by kcatthedog on Nov 13, 2024 9:23:33 GMT -6
wiz ?  |
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Post by andersmv on Nov 13, 2024 9:29:51 GMT -6
I'm going to try and demo it soon. I've got my MM45's running into a Kali sub, it's fine for right now but the crossover and noise floor running into the Kail electronics and crossover really sucks. Would love to get the Barefoot out of the Kali separately and mess around with the time align features. I'm running it all as "one system" right now with my IK Arc Studio hardware box, it was great for workflow reasons. I'll need to get a mulitchannel license of Sonarworks though, that't the only way to separate the sub out (can't do it with the stereo license, which is what I have now).
Looks promising, might have to jump back to Sonarworks if this goes well. I'll have to do it anyway if I go atmos with the Apollo....
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Post by deaconblues on Nov 13, 2024 9:44:01 GMT -6
I recently rebuilt my studio and added more acoustic treatments. Haven't used Trinnov or SoundID before, but was still struggling with low end build up affecting my mixes. I participated in the beta program for this and can say it really did fix the problems I was having. The sweet spot for me seems to be around 60% wet. Much more than that and I can hear the correction and not in a good way. The low end feels tight. I also found that my high-mids were registering slightly wider before - which was false. I'm now I'm able to actually mix wider because I'm hearing it right. This is uncluttering my mixes a bit from L to R when listening elsewhere. From talking to other users, it seems that the SoundID results are significantly better with filtering happening on the Apollo instead of software. Overall: I do believe this has saved me from going with a full Trinnov setup, which I really didn't want to pay for. Set up was really easy, too, which I wasn't expecting.
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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 13, 2024 10:00:38 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct…
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Post by andersmv on Nov 13, 2024 10:17:04 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct… Here's my perspective and how things "evolved"... When I opened the studio here, I started with Adam A7's. Had to do a bunch of stuff for the buildout and buy a lot of stuff at once, I knew the A7's really well and knew I could mix well on them. Had them for a few years, finally upgraded to the Barefoot Footprint 01's when they were first announced. Ran those for about 6 months or so, noticed that I was not catching a lot of harshness issues on them. Broke down and reluctantly tried Sonarworks for the first time, I did not like how it sounded overall but it was definitely revealing the harshness issues clearly. I kind of "eased into things", and was able to get a balance I was comfortable with by running Sonarworks at around 75% or so. Dialed in there, the speakers still sounded familiar with the way I was used to them, and was showing me sibilance problems and other things up top that I wasn't getting before. At the suggestion of someone at Sonarworks, I slowly started turning up the blend about a percent or so every week. I basically turned the blend up until I could hear a big difference, and then backed it off a little. Over the next 6 month period, I gradually worked my way up to 100%. When I got to that point, turning off Sonarworks sounded like complete crap to me. That really surprised me. Even trying to turn it back down to around the 75% blend I started with sounded "off" and bad to me. When I upgraded again to my the MM45's I have now, I started fresh. Shot out the room, went 100% in with the correction. It's been great. If you're getting a brand new pair of speakers and using sonarworks for the the first time, just set it to 100% right out of the gate and go through the normal learning process. If you've got a very familiar pair of speakers that you've mixed on a for a while, the initial "shock" of hearing what sonarworks does is probably going to be way too much. You'll need to start small and work your way in more than likely. That's my take on all of this, and I think it's what sonarworks recommends as well. Everyone's different, but my recommendation would be to treat the blend as a band aid and try to work your way into using it 100%. |
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Post by deaconblues on Nov 13, 2024 11:47:46 GMT -6
That explanation makes some sense to me. They put it in their software, so I’m assuming it’s there for a reason. My reason I used it is because somewhere past 75% I could no longer get mixes to translate - which is the point of correction for me. Below 50% and my low end build up got too strong. I’ll definitely keep experimenting with raising it though.
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Post by wiz on Nov 13, 2024 13:52:47 GMT -6
wiz ? Got it installed last night…Will give it a run today cheers Wiz |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 13, 2024 14:43:33 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct… If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. |
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Post by Johnkenn on Nov 13, 2024 15:08:29 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct… If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. Yeah I was going to say phase…but I don’t know the right word to say. |
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Post by mrgkeys on Nov 13, 2024 15:17:44 GMT -6
Guess I’m about to compare to my Trinnov…I’ve done it a couple of times with the software and always end up preferring the Trinnov…here’s to hoping that changes. Installed it yesterday.. works great and the profile I've been using since 2022 migrated over just fine. For some reason it actually sounds better or at least a bit different and tighter. It was easy and so far it just works, no thinking about it required. Nice to have the plugin off my master buss. |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 13, 2024 15:24:16 GMT -6
If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. Yeah I was going to say phase…but I don’t know the right word to say. The whole concept of this feature just reeks of something marketing guys who didn’t pay attention in high school physics came up with. |
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Post by deaconblues on Nov 13, 2024 15:57:05 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct… If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. Changing the percentage appears to change the intensity of the eq adjustments. So, not really a dry / wet with your signal, but a dry/wet with the capture you did of your room. It just makes the eq peaks lower and the troughs a bit higher as you lower it from wet. No comb filtering as it’s not doing parallel mixing. Not a marketing error, but a user interface one. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 13, 2024 16:06:48 GMT -6
I never understood running a percentage of correction…I don’t understand why you would only want to 60% correct… If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. The same wouldn't apply with a high pass filter though right? If I'm only treating about 200 Hz or something like that.P |
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 13, 2024 17:07:08 GMT -6
If you like anything besides 100% or 0 % you like the sound of comb filtering, Think audio physics 101; you are taking a signal, splitting it changing the phase response now summing then back together. That’s pretty much the definition of how to induce comb filters. The same wouldn't apply with a high pass filter though right? If I'm only treating about 200 Hz or something like that.P If you’re combining it with a signal without the filter, you’re going to have some cancellation / comb filtering. |
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Post by gravesnumber9 on Nov 13, 2024 18:24:34 GMT -6
The same wouldn't apply with a high pass filter though right? If I'm only treating about 200 Hz or something like that.P If you’re combining it with a signal without the filter, you’re going to have some cancellation / comb filtering. I don't do that, I just drag a little bar that determines which frequencies are affected. |
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Post by wiz on Nov 13, 2024 19:29:38 GMT -6
Been using it for an hour this morning.
Works well....then I tried it on the Apollo headphone outputs with profiles set for my two types of headphones...Extreme Isolation EX29s and Beyer DT150s.
Well, my jaw hit the floor.
For years and years I have used a custom made headphone amp as I thought the Apollo ones were shit. With Sound ID running on them...a HUGEEEEE improvement...they are now really good sounding.
Super impressed.
cheers
Wiz
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Post by veggieryan on Nov 13, 2024 19:47:19 GMT -6
Well that is good news. Finally some usable headphone outs on the Apollo platform.
All the early reports seem to indicate this is a clear step above other software monitor correction solutions.
Hope to hear how it compares with the Trinnov.
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ericn
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Post by ericn on Nov 13, 2024 20:52:57 GMT -6
If you’re combining it with a signal without the filter, you’re going to have some cancellation / comb filtering. I don't do that, I just drag a little bar that determines which frequencies are affected. Then other than any phase shift caused by the filter you are fine. |
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Post by veggieryan on Nov 13, 2024 21:11:03 GMT -6
Wiz: Do you have the old original Extreme Isolation EX29 headphones? They really sound much better with the correction?
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Post by wiz on Nov 13, 2024 21:11:53 GMT -6
Wiz: Do you have the old original Extreme Isolation EX29 headphones? They really sound much better with the correction? Yes. 👍 |
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Post by veggieryan on Nov 13, 2024 21:31:41 GMT -6
Like good enough to mix on not just a nice tracking tool?
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Post by veggieryan on Nov 13, 2024 21:32:24 GMT -6
Also which Apollo? X or Gen 2?
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Post by wiz on Nov 13, 2024 21:36:40 GMT -6
X
I don’t ever mix on headphones……it is a significant improvement…and sort of feels like a bonus
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Post by andersmv on Nov 13, 2024 23:31:48 GMT -6
Saw this pop up and YouTube, so I’ll link it below. As far as headphone correction with a SonarWorks, it’s been a complete mixed bag for me. Tried it with some cheaper Shure headphones and some nicer Beyers, really liked the change. Tried it with my Neumann NDH-20’s (the closed back ones) and absolutely hated it. Tried it with the NDH-30’s (open back) for the short stent that I had them, really loved the correction with those. Don’t be surprised when you try it with different sets and get mixed results.
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